Regulation EU2020/877 (all EU airports have Customs without PNR/PPR)

Other countries, like Italy, seem to remain completely silent on this new EU rule

The interesting bit there is that, like Germany, Italy has that general permission allowing immigration (on a PN) at many airports where immigration is not published.

The customs concession under discussion benefits traffic from Switzerland and Norway, and the above general permission then usefully covers the UK (though I think that is an unintended side effect ).

Frans wrote:

I’ve asked AeCS (Aeroclub Switzerland) to dig deeper in this matter, but it seems they have less interest to dig it all out for us. Instead, they come with some theoretical bla bla from a lawyer, which has zero practical use for us pilots. AOPA Switzerland does also nothing. I’m quite disappointed in both of them.

I agree. Both AeCS and AOPA CH are entirely preoccupied with Switzerland itself and don’t spend much effort on international subjects except as they impact operation within Switzerland. AOPA CH tends to pass the ball on anything else off to IAOPA EU.

Peter wrote:

The interesting bit there is that, like Germany, Italy has that general permission allowing immigration (on a PN) at many airports where immigration is not published.

As far as I understood, this kind of “service” costs around 50 – 60 euros. There are some reports telling that some small GA airfields offer customs on PPR basis, but when @boscomantico and I wanted to try it out at Sondrio (LILO), we’ve been refused to get customs PPR.

Coming from Switzerland, a huge part of northern Italy isn’t usable for landing. Except for Aosta and Bolzano, there aren’t any affordable customs airports near the border. Many great Italian destinations weren’t reachable from Switzerland in the past. Even the big GA airfield of Torino (LIMA) doesn’t have customs for example. Venezia-Lido (LIDV) does have it on a 3 hrs PNR basis, but including some 20-30 euros of extra fees and very slow working customs/immigration officers. Now with this new EU rule, one should be able to fly directly from Samedan to Sondrio and back for example, but do Italian authorities have this new EU rule in mind? I highly doubt it. How is gonna ask? My Italian is unfortunately not good enough…

€50-60 is nothing if it avoids a pointless stop. Not to mention the improved safety by avoiding an approach and a climb back to cruise.

Yes, but that was about customs. Peter has deflected the discussion to immigration, and yes, there is regulation in Italy that every airfield may be used for that, subject to certain conditions. It‘s all a bit shady and nobody really understands it, even in Italy. Some ultralight people don’t bother and just fly to Croatia and then straight back to their campo.

Peter has deflected the discussion to immigration

This EU customs measure, together with this immigration concession in Germany and Italy, makes it a lot easier for Brits to come to mainland Europe, and I find it quite impossible to believe that the EU, for wholly obvious political reasons, would have intended that.

So it sounds like a cockup to me.

boscomantico wrote:

Some ultralight people don’t bother and just fly to Croatia and then straight back to their campo.

Sounds 100% “Italian”. I’m afraid there is only one way to find out what happens: More and more pilots need to try and fly from/to Switzerland as well. I guess, 9 from 10 pilots won’t face any trouble and then the 10th pilot faces the full Italian bureaucracy, including a welcoming party with many officials. Not a risk we would like to take.

Even on crossing the Swiss-Italian border by road, I’ve got the feeling that Italian officers are often more interested in traffic that leaves the country, instead of traffic that comes in. It seems they’re quite afraid that someone is going to smuggle a car full of cash out of the country. There is a good chance that they won’t like small GA planes just taking off and disappearing into Switzerland, without any prior notice.

Some ultralight people don’t bother and just fly to Croatia and then straight back to their campo.

On Italy/Croatia, I suppose they only need immigration? (they are not using any old or new customs rules concession), if they are Italian citizens, well it’s unlikely anyone would ever enforce anything as they head straight back to their campo…

Italy/Switzerland would be more “interesting user” case for EU 2020/877

PS: I know a Brit who got caught on that, he was our senior tug pilot on a gliding expedition to Sistron, while ago he went France to Switzerland to Italy with his wife like it’s an “open bar”, don’t know the exact details but he had a charming half-day welcome on landing in Italy, he is an ex-BA captain and flown all over the world, he should have known things better

Not a risk we would like to take.

Italy might “turn over” your plane, but probably won’t do this which is the real risk of somebody testing out this new EU reg in Germany.

Ibra wrote:

On Italy/Croatia, I suppose they only need immigration?

Correct. Croatia is part of the EU, but not Schengen (yet).

Switzerland is the opposite case. Part of Schengen, but not part of the EU. Here comes this new EU 2020/877 rule into place, as you already mentioned it. But we all still highly doubt Italian officials are aware of those new EU rules, as long as the country hasn’t implemented those into their own national laws.