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Jeppesen approach plates vs AIP plates

Well, I agree Jepp probably makes sense for a commercial operator or someone who flies a lot on business. I certainly see what you mean about being able to self-brief from a random plate in the air in under a minute or so.

But for the likes of me who probably flies around half a dozen IFR trips a year, and is very unlikely to be flying an unplanned ILS approach, paying that much for nicer and uniform presentation is just silly.

And of course because I only have an IMCr, I'm never planning an instrument approach outside the UK anyway - so I effectively get a uniform format.

Plus if I'm being facetious I could argue that because I have instructors and 'experts' beating into me the 'fact' that my minimum heights are 500' for any precision approach and 600' for any non-precision approach, the actual minima rarely matter :-) Of course they do matter, and I calculate them. That being said, I'm acutely aware of Timothy's story in PPL/IR: living trumps legality at all times.

EGLM & EGTN

The national approach charts should all be standardised - isn't that why we are all in Europe?

They should also be flight usable. It can't take any more effort to make them like that.

I don't fly off the creases in the map but I have to say for IMC training I do like the gCap charts and would love to see them integrated into skydemon.

Graham, what you say makes complete sense. Of course paying for convenience only matters if you need that convenience. If your approach flying is sporadic than I wouldn't get Jepp either. But I would use a rocketroute or some such that allows me to download all of the relevant plates for flight onto an iPad so they were easily available.

EGTK Oxford

The invoice is just incredibly stupid. They calculate the discount and then they divide the amount /2 ... so instead of € 275 per subscription I pay € 187 per unit ... and € 375 together.

Always worth checking Jepp invoicing anyway. Whenever I have tried to buy something from them it proved to be an "extended exercise". Their UK office in particular has certain, ahem, staff attitude issues... The German office is said to be better.

Plus if I'm being facetious I could argue that because I have instructors and 'experts' beating into me the 'fact' that my minimum heights are 500' for any precision approach and 600' for any non-precision approach, the actual minima rarely matter :-) Of course they do matter, and I calculate them. That being said, I'm acutely aware of Timothy's story in PPL/IR: living trumps legality at all times.

The problem is that one needs to collect a load of info, hopefully from the experience of many pilots (much of which will not ever become public) and then make one's own judgements. For example, if I took at face value every "icing is not the issue it is made out to be" story, I would be dead several times over. I have a collection of photos, sent to me by various pilots who did make it back to a runway, showing what can happen.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I am glad somebody else has that problem too ... for each little change in the subscription they send me tons of papers and eMails nobody really understands ... terrible

OWN JUFDGEMENT , that's the keyword. Never, ever let anybody else talk you into something you don't feel good about.

The national approach charts should all be standardised - isn't that why we are all in Europe?

They should also be flight usable. It can't take any more effort to make them like that.

I don't fly off the creases in the map but I have to say for IMC training I do like the gCap charts and would love to see them integrated into skydemon.<

I am with you and this is what I am trying to advertise to the various channels available to me we need a APP Plate standard on European level ...like the eAIP this could become the eAPP available for download with a small service charge...

EBST

@PiperArcher

If like me, with an IMCr, you may only do approaches at a small number of airports, and can memorise the important parts, then a subscription to Jepp, isn't worth it.

Good for exercising your "grey matter", but flying any instrument approach purely "by heart" (which also does not update automatically :) is not wise. Trust me....

YSCB

I am with you and this is what I am trying to advertise to the various channels available to me we need a APP Plate standard on European level

If we had one, David Cameron would insist on moving to country specific approach plates again

I use ICAO plates and they are perfectly usable. Yes, use need some time to familiarize yourself with different countries but that's part of flight preparation routine. I think I mentioned in the other thread on same subject that I used them in following countries (quality varies but all data is there): Croatia, Bosnia, Slovenia, Serbia, Macedonia, Austria (IMO the best ones), Germany, Italy, Czech, Slovakia, Hungary ...

In addition you can download complete AIP, supplements etc. at Eurocontrol which is definitely must read because some airports have additional procedures and rules described only in AIP. E.g. I would like to see if there's Jepp chart describing SID for LZZI in Slovakia. It's clearly described in AIP with reference to approach chart - there's no separate SID chart published. Can somebody who has Jepp plates check what you get in this particular case?

BTW I have Jepp subscription for GNS530 and I believe it's worth of money.

LDZA LDVA, Croatia
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