Requirement for start clearance

I’ve seen on video “Startup. ABC123 requests engine start.”

Airborne_Again wrote:

Well, according to SERA “Request start-up” does mean a request to start engines! And you can not always do that without permission.

So bingo, you proved that VFR need permission to start their engines as well

AFAIK,

• ATC don’t control apron movements or operations (according to SERA?)
• ‘Engine startup’ may require RAMP, OPS, RFFS permission
• ‘Engine startup’ in apron get delegated to ATC, especially Greece and N. Korea
• ‘IFR startup’ is completely unrelated to engine

I was flying this Friday and Lille told me that ‘startup approved’ at 5000ft

At Mandelieu LFMD, I’ve never asked for startup when flying fixed wing, and have confirmed with instructors that this is normal.

But when I’ve flown the heli, the instructor asks for startup. And when I asked if this was required, he replied as if this was an idiotic question.

There’s nothing in the VAC about it. I guess I could ask Ground, but they might say yes…

Airborne_Again wrote:

Well, according to SERA “Request start-up” does mean a request to start engines! And you can not always do that without permission.

So how does a pilot know when (s)he can or can’t?

Ibra wrote:

So bingo, you proved that VFR need permission to start their engines as well

What are you talking about? I have said no such thing.

So how does a pilot know when (s)he can or can’t?

The AIP will tell.

What are you talking about? I have said no such thing

You are stating that “startup approval” means 1/ starting engine and 2/ in SERA that require permission….that makes it requirement for VFR

Ibra wrote:

You are stating that “startup approval” means 1/ starting the engine and 2/ in SERA that require permission….that makes it a requirement for VFR

I did not! I said 1), not 2).

Ok, then “starting engine” does not require ATC permission as far as SERA is concerned

Airborne_Again wrote:

The AIP will tell.

So if the AIP is silent on the subject,
a) you CAN do it without permission, or
b) you CANNOT do it without permission?
… and on what basis?

@MichaLSA wrote:

@Dimme: Your picture is incomplete. Non-movement areas can be part of the aerodrome (all regulations apply) or outside aerodrome (not all regulations may apply).

Maybe it’s on my grandma’s plot, but as far as clearances/permissions for aircraft movement are concerned, they’re not required in non-movement areas. Unless of course, the land owner decides to deviate from common practices without a NOTAM/AIP update.