I’m just stating training for my UK IR(R) rating and am looking at the application of rules in Ireland. I know that the IR(R) is only applicable within UK airspace. My questions is, however, what is “UK airspace”?
As examples:
Any insight into this would be appreciated as well as guidance as to where to find this in the rules & regs.
Many thanks
Neil
Valid in London FIR & Scottish FIR only.
Exercise of Privileges
The IR(R) may be used in EASA aeroplanes and non-EASA aeroplanes within the UK. The IMC/IR(R) rating may not be used in the airspace of any other country unless permission to do so has been given by the appropriate authority of that country. (UK CAA Website)
Valid in London FIR & Scottish FIR only
IMCr & IRr are valid in Brest FIR (French airspace) when flying UK from/to Jersey, Alderney, Guernsey
AFAIK, there are no geographical restriction on IMCr privileges from UK CAA side, you may need to check with IAA if they accept it IRR/IMCR to fly IFR in RoI (Bravo,…,Golf airspace) as it’s sub-ICAO? just like you would have to check if PtF aircraft flown on NPPL or UK LAPL is OK
IMCr & IRr are valid in Brest FIR (French airspace) when flying UK from/to Jersey, Alderney, Guernsey
Has France published this?
That FIR has some delegation rules applying to it. I don’t remember the details but it used to revert to France at night.
Re the very interesting Irish airspace question, somebody needs to ask the Irish CAA.
That FIR has some delegation rules applying to it. I don’t remember the details but it used to revert to France at night.
At don’t know the answer at night but then you can’t land at night in 3 airports and CTR is Golf…by day, IMCR is valid in CTR when it’s managed by Jersey ATC for the 3 airports: Jersey, Alderney, Guernsey
I doubt OP was asking if IMCR is valid in Irish Golf? he is more interested by ILS landing, controlled IFR takeoff, going IFR airspace and routes…
See post #1. It is about airspaces. Maybe @dublinpilot or @Qalupalik or @tumbleweed know. The IMCR has been around since 1969 so I am sure this has come up before, in 53 years.
Snoopy wrote:
The IR(R) may be used in EASA aeroplanes and non-EASA aeroplanes within the UK. The IMC/IR(R) rating may not be used in the airspace of any other country unless permission to do so has been given by the appropriate authority of that country. (UK CAA Website)
But that is inconsistent within itself which I think Neil_F is pointing at.
If he is over the Republic of Ireland, but in Scottish FIR, then he is :
– not within the UK (so can’t be used according to above quote)
– perhaps not within the airspace of any other country (debatable).
My understanding is Irish airspace is all the airspace over the ROI, irrespective of the fact that some may be delegated to the UK. And therefore the IMCR can’t be used in the Scottish FIR when over the ROI. But I’ve never heard it being clarified and how is a pilot supposed to know where an international border lies other than an FIR division?
In practical terms I suspect nobody will ask any questions if your in IMC in the Scottish FIR even if you are over Irish terrain (provided you don’t crash!)
dublinpilot wrote:
In practical terms I suspect nobody will ask any questions if your in IMC in the Scottish FIR even if you are over Irish terrain (provided you don’t crash!)
You do need valid IR to file IFR flight plan and get entitled to ATC clearance & separation for controlled IFR in airspace….I have not found a single regulation that state you need valid IR to fly IFR in IMC in uncontrolled airspace? this point of having valid IR rating is very moot for Golf uncontrolled IFR, especially if FIR is an uncontrolled airspace does not require radio contact or flight plan
I would be far more curious to know if you can land on ILS in an Irish airport on IFR clearance with UK IMCR?
You do need valid IR to file IFR flight plan and get entitled to ATC clearance & separation for controlled IFR in airspace….I have not found a single regulation that state you need valid IR to fly IFR in IMC in uncontrolled airspace? this point of having valid IR rating is very moot for Golf uncontrolled IFR, especially if FIR is an uncontrolled airspace does not require radio contact or flight plan
I don’t get the above at all.
Outside the UK, you need an EASA or other ICAO IR (and a corresponding aircraft reg) to fly under IFR.
In the UK, you can do it with the IMCR, but only in Classes D-G (or maybe C-G but C is practically unreachable).
CAS or OCAS or ATS or no ATS or flight plan or not is all completely irrelevant to the legality. It affects only the detectability and, if being sentenced, the culpability, but this is a totally different topic. I knew a guy who flew IFR all over Europe with just a PPL, in a PA28, but he knew the ATC lingo and never got caught. It’s easy if you know the system, but that wasn’t the OP’s question. One needs to start a thread called “how to fly illegal IFR and not get caught”.
I would be far more curious to know if you can land on ILS in an Irish airport on IFR clearance with UK IMCR?
Somebody needs to ask the IAA. If they say No to the airspace then you can’t even reach the ILS, let alone fly it 
I am sure the answer is No otherwise we would have heard by now.
My understanding from pilots based in Northern Ireland is that the answer is “no” to IFR flight in the Shannon FIR, and from personal experience the practical boundary is the FIR, not the border.
This is based on flights out both controlled and uncontrolled fields near where the border and the FIR boundary don’t line up.
