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One in seventeen Swiss market share is more than I would have expected – European manufacturers in the US have only about half that market share today and you still see a fair number of European cars on the the road.

One in seventeen in 1965, certainly not today. Betweed Daimler, BMW and VW only you’ll find European manufacturers sell 50% more than that market share in the US today, not 50% less.


Sweden (which was another neutral country, perhaps a coincidence)

Also – not to judge the pertinence of the argument correlating country neutrality with brands of cars imported, but you’ll find Switzerland (other than maybe in public perception) is not a neutral country like Sweden.


Sustenpass 2009…

Last Edited by Silvaire at 29 Jan 00:30

LeSving wrote:

Today, Tesla is indeed a very popular car, at least here in Norway,

“Popular” in the sense of grabbing a lot of attention in the internet hype news scene it is indeed all across Europe. “Popular” in an economic sense that people are actually buying is a Norway exclusive phenomenon. There hasn’t been a single year where the market share of Tesla was more than 1% in Europe – even at the time where Tesla still had “category exclusives”.

That is a good illustration to the same situation as with American cars in Switzerland in the 60ies/70ies: In the end although cars are a very emotional topic for many, what really counts is money. Tesla has been (and partly still is although market share dropped significantly) extremely popular in Norway because Norway heavily subsidized Tesla sales (troth too be told: they subsidized electric car sales but as Tesla has been the only option in some electric car categories 2years ago it was practically a Tesla subsidy). If you just make it cheap enough, European car buyers even buy a Tesla.


Thats just it, make it cheap enough and poeple will buy it.
See Dacia popularity – and especially here in France because of the Renault tie-in.

Malibuflyer wrote:

“Popular” in an economic sense that people are actually buying is a Norway exclusive phenomenon

Well, the Model 3 has been one of the most sold car model the last 1-2 years. I would say that is within the definition of popular A Norwegian phenomenon, sure, but that is also within the definition I almost bought a Model 3 a couple of years ago, tried it, and and used the money to buy myself an ULPower 350 i instead The Model 3 is superb to drive, handling wise and with 4WD and a gazillion electric HP for the top model probably one of the best there is, but the ergonomics with the single touch screen put me off completely. Then there is the quality which is way below standard. Now I have a Mazda MX-30. Pure electric, but it will come as a hybrid this year I believe with brand new Wankel range extender which should be interesting. Best ergonomics I could find, big wheels and looks cool (+ all kinds of gadgetry), the only minus is a shorter range, but for me that is irrelevant. Still got my e-Up as well, haven’t sold it yet, it has been too cold lately to bother with.

The only other US car that has had some popularity here are big SUVs, Chevrolet Suburban as the archetypical model (had a Blazer myself for several years), lots of them in the 90s and early 2000, but also this Jeep Grand Cherokee has been popular over several years. That time is gone now however.

Silvaire wrote:

Most of the European manufacturers had given up by then, e.g. the UK industry, French industry, Italians except exotics and Alfa which kept trying until 1995 etc. The German cars never disappeared but did mostly move upmarket where the competitIon was less and they could market based on status.

Don’t know about that. VW Golf came in 1974, and has been a success like nothing else on this planet. It’s a real Volkswagen in every aspect of the word over the last 45 years. Renault and Peugeot has always sold millions and millions of cars all over the world.

The elephant is the circulation

I meant that by in the 80s and 90s most of the European car manufacturers had given up trying to compete in the US market. What was left by the late 90s was the German manufacturers selling in relatively low volume (VW selling the most cars), Jaguar, Range Rover and the exotics like Ferrari. Some of the lower cost manufacturers have now re-entered the US and are giving it a try again. The French brands gave up in the 80s and have not returned although they still sell in Mexico. In order to keep a foot in the US market, Renault merged with Nissan, which was and is a successful brand in the US.

Volvo may have sold continuously in the US too, i.e. I think they never left and that you can still buy one here.

Last Edited by Silvaire at 29 Jan 14:52

Silvaire wrote:

In order to keep a foot in the US market, Renault merged with Nissan, which was and is a successful brand in the US.

Nissan only sells their Leaf here, in addition to one or two small SUVs and small electric vans. Mitsubishi has given up on, not only Norway, but entire Europe I have heard, but I think you still can get the Outlander PHEV which has been, and is, very popular, and the L200 pickup truck.

The elephant is the circulation

LeSving wrote:

Mitsubishi has given up on, not only Norway, but entire Europe I have heard

I didn’t know that, but it fits with some local news here. Last summer a quite successful local garage two villages away (a Mitsubishi franchised dealer) suddenly announced it was going independent but didn’t say why.


Car dealing is going to change dramatically – the new model is looking like franchised dealers will be front end sales room but cars will be supplied direct from manufacturer , without the old thing of dealers buying stock and then selling on. Pricing will be centrally controlled. Differentiation will be on customer service experience and pricing / sales of additional services. I was sceptical but when I read up it seems dealers and customers are quite up for it.

Posts are personal views only.
Oxfordshire, United Kingdom
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