Peter wrote:
.. pilots who learnt to fly on a farm and never having had any formal training at a flying school.
Which, is pretty much exactly what LT (Norway CAA) said about foreign European RFs. A couple of years ago they refused to approve anyone who had done training at any foreign RF and came back to get a Norwegian license. 
Maybe that is the main problem here?
The UK PPL training scene is pretty bad in places, but not quite that bad
Mind you, if you read the book Propellerhead, you may well reach the LT’s conclusion, so maybe that is what the EASA producers did?
I am sure the same problem exists everywhere. Most pilots stick to short local flights, as a result.
Pure heresay, but I’ve heard that airline pilots are not at all immune to this misdemeanour and are essentially never reported.
On duty, they are in CAS so can’t bust it If they bust on a private flight they will get reported to the same extent as anyone else gets reported in that particular country (the UK seems extremely vigorous there) because ATC don’t know the pilot at that point, but whether they get “actioned” probably depends… I suspect you are right that licensing action is unlikely since it would be hard-hitting, but a cynic would make the same comment on a pilot who is in the military, or is ex military… The CAA enforcement guy is likely to be ex mil…
Peter wrote:
What do other countries do?
Very much dependent on circumstances and individual involved, but I was once flying north from around Annecy in France toward Lausanne and was proactively warned just in time by an alert Geneva Information person that I needed to be below xxx ft within yyy miles on my route when I was still several thousand feet above that. I thanked him and adjusted my heading enough to avoid a transgression and give me time for a more leisurely descent than if I had continued on the same heading.
Another time, I called 10 miles from CAS to request TMA transit at Bern. I was told to standby and having not heard further, I started a 360 turn just in time to avoid entry. I was about 90 degrees into the turn (ie the controller would have seen it on his screen) when he came back with clearance to cross. I strongly suspected an attempt to lure me into an airspace infringement. How much tolerance (if any) before a warning or fine is levied is not public.
Peter wrote:
On duty, they are in CAS so can’t bust it
Meant an altitude bust, not CAS bust.
chflyer wrote:
I strongly suspected an attempt to lure me into an airspace infringement.
? “really” ?
On Monday this week I was flying the PA-17 from Enstone to Shoreham on the route shown. As I came over Benson I took a basic service from Farnborough LARS West. I’d been hoping for a traffic service but the controller was too busy to spend time on an identifying turn for a non-transponding aircraft.
I was at 3,200ft and in receipt of a tailwind (every knot counts in a PA-17!), so did not want to descend to avoid the 2,500ft-base section of the LTMA which you can see that my magenta line crosses. So overhead Reading I turned right onto a course of 180 degrees to avoid the LTMA, intending to turn left again once clear. I advised the controller what I was doing.
Tracking south parallel and very close to the LTMA boundary, the controller suddenly decided she wanted to identify me. She called “Golf Kilo Delta, for identification turn left heading 140 degrees”. I replied “No, that’ll take me into the LTMA.”
Make of that what you will.
Graham wrote:
Tracking south parallel and very close to the LTMA boundary, the controller suddenly decided she wanted to identify me. She called “Golf Kilo Delta, for identification turn left heading 140 degrees”. I replied “No, that’ll take me into the LTMA.”Make of that what you will.
Eff-up? But it would be interesting to see the subsequent actions if you infringed having been instructed by ATC to do so… 
regards, SD..
skydriller wrote:
Eff-up? But it would be interesting to see the subsequent actions if you infringed having been instructed by ATC to do so…regards, SD..
Not a clearance so it is still on you.
