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Tips for southern Norway flight (Oslo and Bergen)

Are you sure that the MYPPR site isn’t programmed to automatically grant PPR only on specific dates/times?

That’s exactly it, as I wrote above. IMO that MyPPR goes right up there along with GPS and moving maps regarding usefulness.

OCAS, they can’t really do more than advise you.

It happens all the time, or rather from time to time depending on traffic and time of day. I have even been asked to stay above certain levels due to other traffic (ambulance helicopter) outside the TMA, effectively making my airspace restrictions less restrictive.

The number one priority of ATC is safety, not arbitrary airspace limits.

The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway

boscomantico wrote:

PPR is required. It’s a pure formality though. Since I didn’t have any pressing questions, I decided to tra out the MYPPR site that was mentioned above. It gives you an instant OK on the PPR. Obviously, this only works where PPR is merely a data collection act. (The fact these these types of PPR are pointless is a different subject).
Are you sure that the MYPPR site isn’t programmed to automatically grant PPR only on specific dates/times? Kjeller is a military airport and IIRC, it is occasionally closed to civil traffic because of military activity.

regarding transport: there being nobody from the flying club or so, there was nobody to offer a ride to Lillestrom station, so I called a taxi, which arrived after 5 minutes. The cost to Lillestrom station would have been 17 Euros. I also asked how much the ride all the way to Oslo (central station) would cost, and he said 70 Euros. Since we were in three (and would thus have had to buy three train tickets), and since it was so hot (30 degrees), we decided to bite the bullet and take the taxi all the way to Oslo. Took about 15-20 minutes. Same on the return. (BTW, I actually asked the customs people if they would drive us up to Lillestrom station , but they declined, saying that they didn’t have enough space for all of us in their car).

There is a bus stop a few minutes walk from the apron. A 5 minute bus ride takes you to the railway station with frequent and fast (10 min) train connections to Oslo Central Station.

ATC was very nice. The only complaint is they seem to tend to give aircraft altitude restrictions when they are under the TMA, which are more restrictive than the actual airspace. In other words, they kept me low even though I was already way OCAS. Don’t like that too much. They seem to assume that the pilot does not have a proper VFR moving map with the TMA limits on his lap.

OCAS, they can’t really do more than advise you.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

Kjeller

boscomantico wrote:

when I was there, both on arrival and on departure, there was no other flying activity whatsoever, despite glorious sunshine. Felt odd.

The couple of times I have been there in recent years there’s been very little activity indeed. But that was either in July when everybody was on vacation, or on a weekday in September when most people were at work. Or so I thought.

I didn’t do an further research on how refuelling with 100LL “works”: In other words, I did not find out whether currently the pump can be made to work – as the website says – with a BP card

Definitely BP card. At least that was the case in July a year ago. No other means of payment available unless you make a friend there.

Prior to departure from Kjeller to Bergen, I therefore called up the duty manager to ask where and how to pay the landing fee. He said (probably because he was away) that it was my lucky day and that there wouldn’t be any.

Hmmm. There seems to be a pattern. I have not paid anything either despite sending several e-mails. Don’t tell anyone or someone could get in trouble.

Bergen

boscomantico wrote:

I didn’t enquire how exactly refuelling with 100LL works

It is a self-serve automaton. Don’t remember if it takes BP card or Visa/MasterCard, but it is definitely one of them because apart from the Total card, that’s all I have to pay with.

LFPT, LFPN

boscomantico wrote:

No need to go further north if you don’t have the time

Say what ? The nice cities are Bergen, Ålesund, Trondheim, Tromsø, Røros. Besides, Northern Norway with Lofoten in particular (+ many other places) are nothing like the more massive mountains on the southern coast. Also, north of Bergen is where you will find the large fjords.

IMO the best experience you will get by flying with a more “bushy” airplane. Maybe with a tent, and spend time outside in the nature. The cities in Norway cannot compete with Paris, Rome, London etc regarding “city stuff” anyway. For something fun in the summer, fly to Stryn for instance (small grass strip), then spend a few days skiing (slalom) on the glaciers with nothing but skis and a boxer shorts (try not to fall though ) In early spring, the ice strips on frozen lakes are always popular.

I also think you went a bit early to Kjeller. This Sunday (today) there where the yearly fly-in there ( http://www.flydagen.no/ ) People were probably preparing for that.

The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway

Regarding PPR (Prior Permission Requirements). There are no PPR for Avinor airports, they are all public, thus PPR is irrelevant. Some require that you file a flight plan (Bergen and Gardermoen). Others require a flight plan, but only if you use the airport outside opening hours. Røros (ENRO) works this way, and Norway Control handles it. I assume it will be handled by remote towers soon, and this is probably how they will work?

But back to PPR. PPR is a requirements for all non-public airports. But, the case is that for most of these airports, there are no need for special permission to use them. They are open and free to use by anyone. The problem is; if you have never been there, how would you know? Hence, MyPPR. MyPPR can be configured so that everybody using MyPPR for that airport get instant and automatic reply of acceptance. The default is “open and free”, but if the airport is unusable in some way, this can also easily be handled with MyPPR. We have a field operated by my club, Meråker (ENMO) that works like that. Open for everybody (using MyPPR), but a small fee (€5) is appreciated. There are also quite a few airports that actually require prior permission, Oppdal (ENOP) for instance. For these airports you will receive a “manual” reply, but since the right persons are given e-mail and text messages and whatever, it is much easier and faster to receive an answer, than finding obscure web pages, phone numbers and calling around to find a person actually answering the phone.

This MyPPR is rather new though, some airport owners don’t even know about it (most by the look of it). For me, so far it has worked flawlessly. You will never find Avinor airports on MyPPR though.

The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway

As promised, some notes, both on the airports used and on the two cities.

Kjeller (ENKJ)

  • PPR is required. It’s a pure formality though. Since I didn’t have any pressing questions, I decided to tra out the MYPPR site that was mentioned above. It gives you an instant OK on the PPR. Obviously, this only works where PPR is merely a data collection act. (The fact these these types of PPR are pointless is a different subject). I can’t totally recommend MYPPR though, since a) it so far only covers a very reduced numbers of airfields, b) getting PPR this way doesn’t allow you to ask any questions or elimiate any doubts, and c) once you get the PPR, you later get a follow-up message via email, but that one is in Norwegian only! I somehow understood that they want you to confirm the movement (as a kind of “airfield logbook” entry) so I did that.
  • I did send the inbound FPL to the Norwegian customs, as required. Sure enough, upon arrival in the parking area, they awaited us (in three!). This was probably because a) it was 10:30 in the morning and b) Kjeller is close to Oslo. There were reasonably friendly, but made us lose 15 minutes for a totally pointless (superficial) check of the documents, the bags and the aircraft.
  • when I was there, both on arrival and on departure, there was no other flying activity whatsoever, despite glorious sunshine. Felt odd.
  • in fact, there was absolutely no flying club member or duty manager to be seen. Prior to departure from Kjeller to Bergen, I therefore called up the duty manager to ask where and how to pay the landing fee. He said (probably because he was away) that it was my lucky day and that there wouldn’t be any.
  • I didn’t do an further research on how refuelling with 100LL “works”: In other words, I did not find out whether currently the pump can be made to work – as the website says – with a BP card (which everybody has) or – as the AIP says – if it requires a Statoil key (which nobody has). A presume the former is the case, which would be good because it would make pilots independent from other people (and as I experienced, there may in fact be absolutely nobody there, despite great weather.)
  • regarding transport: there being nobody from the flying club or so, there was nobody to offer a ride to Lillestrom station, so I called a taxi, which arrived after 5 minutes. The cost to Lillestrom station would have been 17 Euros. I also asked how much the ride all the way to Oslo (central station) would cost, and he said 70 Euros. Since we were in three (and would thus have had to buy three train tickets), and since it was so hot (30 degrees), we decided to bite the bullet and take the taxi all the way to Oslo. Took about 15-20 minutes. Same on the return. (BTW, I actually asked the customs people if they would drive us up to Lillestrom station , but they declined, saying that they didn’t have enough space for all of us in their car).
  • otherwise, nothing more to say about ENKJ. Nice scenery in the vicinity.

Bergen-Flesland (ENBR):

  • first of all, I found out that they do indeed NOT require any PPR for the parking (the AIP is a bit ambiguous about that). Which is good. So, if you go VFR, then you need to do nothing, except to file a flightplan. If you go IFR, you need a slot, which as informed above, seems to be a very easy and relaxed thing
  • the airport can be quite busy during certain times of the day, and then again, totally dead for hours during other times of the day
  • the aiport is huge. Visting GA is parked in the very north of the airport (which isn’t much of a problem, since you get picked up by a bus anyway).
  • for some stupid reason, upon ARRIVAL, pilots and passengers have to pass through security (bags scanning etc.). That’s a pity, but it only took 5 minutes.
  • The shuttle bus to Bergen City is indeed very frequent. If you book it online, you save a couple of Euros on the fare. Good service.
  • I paid the landing fee (or takeoff fee, whatever) on the morning of our departure, using Avinor’s website. Very neat. Way to go! Cost (at all Avinor airports) is some 39 Euros (if going abroad as the next stop, it’s a bit less, due to no VAT).
  • upon arriving at the airport, you have to stay downstairs (at street level). There, in the very left hand corner of the hall, you go to the Avinor “Service Centre” counter. Let them know you are the crew of a private flight to depart (and of course, always declare all your pax as crew!). Then, a lady will bring you straight to security and then to some gate where a bus waits for you to bring you to the aircraft
  • ATC was very nice. The only complaint is they seem to tend to give aircraft altitude restrictions when they are under the TMA, which are more restrictive than the actual airspace. In other words, they kept me low even though I was already way OCAS. Don’t like that too much. They seem to assume that the pilot does not have a proper VFR moving map with the TMA limits on his lap.
  • I didn’t enquire how exactly refuelling with 100LL works

Kristiansand Kjevik (ENCN) (we used this airport for refuelling, before heading back home to Germany):

  • no PPR whatsoever required.
  • the VFR approach, particularly to runway 03, is just BEAUTIFUL.
  • a very quick turnaround is possible. The Avgas pump is just next to the threshold 03. It works with credit cards. UNFORTUNATELY, it doesn’t seem to work any longer to get tax-free Avgas (~1.2€) there if going abroad. This used to work 5 years ago. This time, despite selecting “International” on the screen, the sytem applied the full rate (~1.9€). (Probably, in the meantime, someone found out that merely going international, on a private flight, should not lead to the fuel being tax-free…). That’s a pity. But nevertheless, I can still recommend ENCN as a fuel-stop. Remember that paying the landing fee is via the ipad, so the whole stop can be done in 15 minutes.
  • the departure from runway 03, likewise, is very scenic.

Oslo city:

  • as said above, I didn’t get very excited about it. It’s a rather modern city. The most modern parts (Aker Brygge area and Sorenga) seem like a photocopy of the Hamburg Hafenviertel. Out of the 4 “Scandinavian” capitals (Copenhagen, Stockholm, Helsinki and Olso), my no.1 is Copenhagen, Stockholm is a close no. 2, no. 3 is Helsinki and Oslo is just behind that. That side, I simply didn’t have the time to explore all parts of it.
  • a tip: get registered and get the app for “Oslo city bikes”. These are everywhere and a good way to see a lot of things in a limited amount of time. Very basic bikes, but good enough to get around. Cheap.
  • hotels are incredibly expensive in Oslo. Crazy. Food isn’t all that expensive. Same for beer. Wines are expensive. Good seafood in the “Fiskeriet” (photo above).
  • if you happen to be lucky and get to Oslo in the same kind of weather as I did (15 hours of sunshine and 30 degrees), do go sunbathing and swimming at either the tip of Sorenga or at the tip past Aker Bygge. The water isn’t THAT cold, and the scenery is breathtaking.

Bergen city:

  • the scenery, with all the lamdsacpe surrounding the city, is just different. Wonderful. But go there only if the weather is good.
  • no bicycles needed. Everything can be discovered on foot. Do take the Floibanen and go up to Floien. Not terribly expensive. A wonderful view over the city and the surrounding landscape will await you, no matter if you have to share it with many other tourists. Nice cafe up there and you can spend some quality time there.
  • Bryggen however is a disappointment. A row of wooden houses with a few tourist shops and eateries. That’s it.
  • but there are some very nice quarters elsewhere. Like Nostet, Stolen and Skuteviken.
  • again, if you happen to be lucky and get to Bergen in the same kind of weather as I did (15 hours of sunshine a day and 30 degrees), then go sunbathing and swimming at Nordnes.
  • hotels are not quite as expensive as in Oslo, it seems. Best Western Hotell Hordaheimen was perfectly located, a good hotel and not too expensive. Good seafood at the Fjellskal restaurant.

A final note on the flying: the scenery in rural southern Norway (i.e. south of the line Oslo, Sogndal, Bergen) is amazing. No need to go further north if you don’t have the time. Do these flights VFR, low level. But remember you will be in a very remote area. That said, even at low levels, we always managed to maintain radio contact with Norway Control.

Hope this is useful for others heading up that way.









Last Edited by boscomantico at 03 Jun 21:10
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

boscomantico wrote:

We didn’t like Oslo all that much as a city, but it didn’t matter

I do understand you… I have always thought that the two good things about Oslo are

  • The seafront from the new Operabuilding, via Akershus fortress to Aker Brygge (your pictures 1-4), the Oslo fjord
  • The Oslo forest for hiking, skiing and biking

Also the fact that it is a relatively small town…

Last Edited by Aviathor at 01 Jun 16:08
LFPT, LFPN

Well, I am back in Germany from a superb little trip to Oslo and Bergen, during this record high pressure phase and southern Scandinavian heat wave, which will go into the history books up there.

First of all, thanks for all the pointers, in particular to Aviathor! Everything went fine and just as planned. Both Kjeller airport and Bergen airport were fine.

We didn’t like Oslo all that much as a city, but it didn’t matter, as we spent most of the day swimming and sunbathing anyway. Bergen – although very touristic of course – was fantastic. The scenery is unique. Of course, the weather helped a lot. Again, we spent half the day swimming and sunbathing, but also went up to Flöien which is a magic place indeed.

Don’t know if I’ll write a trip report here. I have tons of good photos of course. Let’s see. In any case, I will at least share some technical notes on the airports we used (Kjeller, Bergen and Kjevik) as soon as I have a little bit of time, just to round up this thread.

For now, just a few iphone shots…

Oslo:



Bergen:




Enroute:

Last Edited by boscomantico at 01 Jun 14:36
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

boscomantico wrote:

Things still to do:
-(advance) pay landing fees at Bergen

They are not landing fees but departure fees you should pay prior to departure.

-advise Norwegian customs for landing at Kjeller

Since you have read the VFR guide I am sure you already know that, but you only need to mail your flight plan to customs 4 hours prior to departure.

And do not fall for this temptation:
Aircraft shall not depart before the time stated in the FPL without prior permission from the Customs service. Persons who arrive with the aircraft shall not leave the aircraft prior to the arrival time stated in the FPL. (source: VFR Guide for Norway)

-advise customs for departure from my home airport
-flightplans (the easiest bit)
-sort fuel
-pack my shorts
-find out about things to do/see in Oslo and Bergen

Bergen

  • Walk around Bryggen to Bergenshus.
  • Visit the Bergenshus fortress.
  • Take Flöibanen to Flöien, have lunch on their terrace with breathtaking view over Bergen and go for a hike.
  • Have an unforgettable fish dinner at “Enhjørningen” (The Unicorn); start with the Whale Carpaccio.
  • Walk around the fish market – another opportunity to eat.
  • Walk around the “smau”, those narrow streets with old houses that are typical for Bergen.
  • Visit Fantoft Stavkirke. It is somewhat difficult to get there by public transportation if you are allergic to walking.
  • Visit the Gamlehaugen royal residence.
  • Try organising a trip with Flåsbanen between Myrdal and Gudvangen. There are daytrips combining train, bus and boat.
  • If interested in classical music, visit Edvard Grieg Museum Troldhaugen

Oslo

  • Visit the Akershus fortress and museums
  • Take a strawl on the pier in front of the Oslo Town Hall and Aker Brygge, and have a beer on one of the boat restaurants.
  • Take the Bygdøy Ferry from the Town Hall pier (cost of a bus ticket), enjoy the scenery
  • When at Bygdøy, visit the Oslo Folk Museum and the Viking Ship museum.
  • For nightlife, you may want to try out Bogstadveien/Hegdehaugsveien, although Karl Johan’s Gate and “spikersuppa” attracts the crowds, as well as Aker Brygge.
Last Edited by Aviathor at 28 May 17:13
LFPT, LFPN

Just a small point – it appears that you do not need to pay the landing fees in advance.
You can set the date also retrospectively on the website (for both single and weekly fees).

...
EDM_, Germany
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