Are you sure that the MYPPR site isn’t programmed to automatically grant PPR only on specific dates/times?
That’s exactly it, as I wrote above. IMO that MyPPR goes right up there along with GPS and moving maps regarding usefulness.
OCAS, they can’t really do more than advise you.
It happens all the time, or rather from time to time depending on traffic and time of day. I have even been asked to stay above certain levels due to other traffic (ambulance helicopter) outside the TMA, effectively making my airspace restrictions less restrictive.
The number one priority of ATC is safety, not arbitrary airspace limits.
boscomantico wrote:
PPR is required. It’s a pure formality though. Since I didn’t have any pressing questions, I decided to tra out the MYPPR site that was mentioned above. It gives you an instant OK on the PPR. Obviously, this only works where PPR is merely a data collection act. (The fact these these types of PPR are pointless is a different subject).Are you sure that the MYPPR site isn’t programmed to automatically grant PPR only on specific dates/times? Kjeller is a military airport and IIRC, it is occasionally closed to civil traffic because of military activity.
regarding transport: there being nobody from the flying club or so, there was nobody to offer a ride to Lillestrom station, so I called a taxi, which arrived after 5 minutes. The cost to Lillestrom station would have been 17 Euros. I also asked how much the ride all the way to Oslo (central station) would cost, and he said 70 Euros. Since we were in three (and would thus have had to buy three train tickets), and since it was so hot (30 degrees), we decided to bite the bullet and take the taxi all the way to Oslo. Took about 15-20 minutes. Same on the return. (BTW, I actually asked the customs people if they would drive us up to Lillestrom station , but they declined, saying that they didn’t have enough space for all of us in their car).
There is a bus stop a few minutes walk from the apron. A 5 minute bus ride takes you to the railway station with frequent and fast (10 min) train connections to Oslo Central Station.
ATC was very nice. The only complaint is they seem to tend to give aircraft altitude restrictions when they are under the TMA, which are more restrictive than the actual airspace. In other words, they kept me low even though I was already way OCAS. Don’t like that too much. They seem to assume that the pilot does not have a proper VFR moving map with the TMA limits on his lap.
OCAS, they can’t really do more than advise you.
Kjeller
boscomantico wrote:
when I was there, both on arrival and on departure, there was no other flying activity whatsoever, despite glorious sunshine. Felt odd.
The couple of times I have been there in recent years there’s been very little activity indeed. But that was either in July when everybody was on vacation, or on a weekday in September when most people were at work. Or so I thought.
I didn’t do an further research on how refuelling with 100LL “works”: In other words, I did not find out whether currently the pump can be made to work – as the website says – with a BP card
Definitely BP card. At least that was the case in July a year ago. No other means of payment available unless you make a friend there.
Prior to departure from Kjeller to Bergen, I therefore called up the duty manager to ask where and how to pay the landing fee. He said (probably because he was away) that it was my lucky day and that there wouldn’t be any.
Hmmm. There seems to be a pattern. I have not paid anything either despite sending several e-mails. Don’t tell anyone or someone could get in trouble.
Bergen
boscomantico wrote:
I didn’t enquire how exactly refuelling with 100LL works
It is a self-serve automaton. Don’t remember if it takes BP card or Visa/MasterCard, but it is definitely one of them because apart from the Total card, that’s all I have to pay with.
boscomantico wrote:
No need to go further north if you don’t have the time
Say what ? The nice cities are Bergen, Ålesund, Trondheim, Tromsø, Røros. Besides, Northern Norway with Lofoten in particular (+ many other places) are nothing like the more massive mountains on the southern coast. Also, north of Bergen is where you will find the large fjords.
IMO the best experience you will get by flying with a more “bushy” airplane. Maybe with a tent, and spend time outside in the nature. The cities in Norway cannot compete with Paris, Rome, London etc regarding “city stuff” anyway. For something fun in the summer, fly to Stryn for instance (small grass strip), then spend a few days skiing (slalom) on the glaciers with nothing but skis and a boxer shorts (try not to fall though ) In early spring, the ice strips on frozen lakes are always popular.
I also think you went a bit early to Kjeller. This Sunday (today) there where the yearly fly-in there ( http://www.flydagen.no/ ) People were probably preparing for that.
Regarding PPR (Prior Permission Requirements). There are no PPR for Avinor airports, they are all public, thus PPR is irrelevant. Some require that you file a flight plan (Bergen and Gardermoen). Others require a flight plan, but only if you use the airport outside opening hours. Røros (ENRO) works this way, and Norway Control handles it. I assume it will be handled by remote towers soon, and this is probably how they will work?
But back to PPR. PPR is a requirements for all non-public airports. But, the case is that for most of these airports, there are no need for special permission to use them. They are open and free to use by anyone. The problem is; if you have never been there, how would you know? Hence, MyPPR. MyPPR can be configured so that everybody using MyPPR for that airport get instant and automatic reply of acceptance. The default is “open and free”, but if the airport is unusable in some way, this can also easily be handled with MyPPR. We have a field operated by my club, Meråker (ENMO) that works like that. Open for everybody (using MyPPR), but a small fee (€5) is appreciated. There are also quite a few airports that actually require prior permission, Oppdal (ENOP) for instance. For these airports you will receive a “manual” reply, but since the right persons are given e-mail and text messages and whatever, it is much easier and faster to receive an answer, than finding obscure web pages, phone numbers and calling around to find a person actually answering the phone.
This MyPPR is rather new though, some airport owners don’t even know about it (most by the look of it). For me, so far it has worked flawlessly. You will never find Avinor airports on MyPPR though.
As promised, some notes, both on the airports used and on the two cities.
Kjeller (ENKJ)
Bergen-Flesland (ENBR):
Kristiansand Kjevik (ENCN) (we used this airport for refuelling, before heading back home to Germany):
Oslo city:
Bergen city:
A final note on the flying: the scenery in rural southern Norway (i.e. south of the line Oslo, Sogndal, Bergen) is amazing. No need to go further north if you don’t have the time. Do these flights VFR, low level. But remember you will be in a very remote area. That said, even at low levels, we always managed to maintain radio contact with Norway Control.
Hope this is useful for others heading up that way.
boscomantico wrote:
We didn’t like Oslo all that much as a city, but it didn’t matter
I do understand you… I have always thought that the two good things about Oslo are
Also the fact that it is a relatively small town…
Well, I am back in Germany from a superb little trip to Oslo and Bergen, during this record high pressure phase and southern Scandinavian heat wave, which will go into the history books up there.
First of all, thanks for all the pointers, in particular to Aviathor! Everything went fine and just as planned. Both Kjeller airport and Bergen airport were fine.
We didn’t like Oslo all that much as a city, but it didn’t matter, as we spent most of the day swimming and sunbathing anyway. Bergen – although very touristic of course – was fantastic. The scenery is unique. Of course, the weather helped a lot. Again, we spent half the day swimming and sunbathing, but also went up to Flöien which is a magic place indeed.
Don’t know if I’ll write a trip report here. I have tons of good photos of course. Let’s see. In any case, I will at least share some technical notes on the airports we used (Kjeller, Bergen and Kjevik) as soon as I have a little bit of time, just to round up this thread.
For now, just a few iphone shots…
Oslo:
Bergen:
Enroute:
boscomantico wrote:
Things still to do:
-(advance) pay landing fees at Bergen
They are not landing fees but departure fees you should pay prior to departure.
-advise Norwegian customs for landing at Kjeller
Since you have read the VFR guide I am sure you already know that, but you only need to mail your flight plan to customs 4 hours prior to departure.
And do not fall for this temptation:
Aircraft shall not depart before the time stated in the FPL without prior permission from the Customs service. Persons who arrive with the aircraft shall not leave the aircraft prior to the arrival time stated in the FPL. (source: VFR Guide for Norway)
-advise customs for departure from my home airport
-flightplans (the easiest bit)
-sort fuel
-pack my shorts
-find out about things to do/see in Oslo and Bergen
Bergen
Oslo
Just a small point – it appears that you do not need to pay the landing fees in advance.
You can set the date also retrospectively on the website (for both single and weekly fees).