Why Morocco? Aerostar is all that and more and they actually know how to put a bog standard metal plane together. Plus FAA and EASA tickets. Plus it’s in Europe.
I think the biggest obstacle to any aerospace startup today is the overregulation. I looked at starting something with a collegue from work a number of years ago. For producing what would have been effectively a piece of tin foil we would have required about 10 times the value of the product in accompanying paperwork. The other issue we faced was licensing and time to obtain the licences, so even though we could have sold the product for about half the price of a monopoly incumbent we were effectively blocked out of the market by regulations.
I too think it would cost at least $ 700 K – and with a price like that i would hardly be competitive.
If it had BRS system, a glass cockpit – it would still be (25 knots?) slower than the SR22. Since it costs the same to build, maintain and fly a 310 hp aircraft and a 250 hp one I don’t see how it could compete with the CIrrus.
It IS a nice aircraft, many like metal airplanes (me included) and for some RG is important. But with CAPS, the highers speeds and the 5th seat the G5 Cirrus will win and take away most of the market.
I don’t eve see the Panthera taking away much of Cirrus’ sales, let alone a new TB20.
It is nowhere near 25kt slower at the same fuel flow. In fact it does exactly the same speed at the same fuel flow 
The SR22 has a bigger motor so it goes faster and burns more fuel to do it. It would be a different market segment. How much is a new SR22 today?
With Republic of Ireland and Corsica being in the top productivity league on that map, I’d like to know how it was compiled
Aerostar is all that
Actually, my approach in business has always been not to rely on cheap labour (which comes with many problems) but to design-out the need for labour. In GA mfg you would use tooling, and perhaps get a standard wiring harness (a huge labour item) made in China, using Raychem wire.
You cannot out-design labor and make it look like a fully automated Mercedes Benz assembly line without capital. Unless you have Chinese amounts of capital to throw at new tooling like Mooney seems to have you’re back to square one.
Having said that Aerostar has all the tooling you would want, and is a subcontractor to TBM already… so there doesn’t seem to be much of an issue with the workforce. As a datapoint a new ultimate category YAK-52 with a 400HP modern radial and modern avionics will set you back less than 300k US. Is it possible to make a non-aerobatic TB20 with a standard Lycosaurus for less than that? I’m pretty sure it is.
It is nowhere near 25kt slower at the same fuel flow. In fact it does exactly the same speed at the same fuel flow The SR22 has a bigger motor so it goes faster and burns more fuel to do it. It would be a different market segment. How much is a new SR22 today?
I was always sure the SR22 is faster at the same fuel flow. Can you give me soe numbers? But anway, even with a higher fuel flow the TOTAL fuel for the same distance will be the same – because the flight is shorter.
I think an SR22-G5 NA, all options, with the import tax, ferry flight, registration is probably about € 800 K in Germany. I wonder who buys (or can afford to) these planes! I know one guy who bought a new one, but AFAIK he sold a computer company for hundreds of millions.
But a new TB20 would be € 600 K too (at least) and most people will rather buy a 6 months old SR22 then. I would. I don’t see why itÄs a “different market segment”. I think it’s very much the same market segment.
POH TB20
POH SR22 NA
Sorry, bad editing, the figures in the center are for ISA
So a FF of ca. 14 Gallons/h gives a TAS of 151 vs. 169 kts. (Mine does about 167-168 at 14 gph, because it become a knot or two slower with the 4-blade prop.)
Can you give me soe numbers?
You cannot out-design labor and make it look like a fully automated Mercedes Benz assembly line without capital.
Sure. But there is a lot one can do. And I keep coming back to the same Q… can anybody offer costings supporting their selling price?
Another small detail: you could knock some 20% off the retail price simply by cutting out dealers. Firms like Air Touring got 15-20% for selling a TB20 but they offered no obvious value for it.
In the same way, a Socata parts disti offers no value over Socata shipping the parts directly. The disti keeps no stock anyway; they order the parts back to back, so what is the point? You just wait an extra week, and pay ~ 30% more for it. It’s an industry tradition, and a newcomer could bomb these old structures.
POH data, low level, best economy (SR22NA)
4000 ft / 11.3 GPH / 154 KTAS
6000 ft / 11.3 GPH / 157 KTAS
That’s the numbers I see all the time
(and 4000 ft is really not so interesting)
