Yeager wrote:
Are any of the available Traffic Collision Warning systems (such as PowerFlarm Fusion etc.) able to connect to the Trig TT31 (ADS-B out capable) Transponder and be used as the GPS source (SIL 0 or SIL 1+) for the Transponder?
The various “Flarm” boxes output the typical GPS NMEA messages on their output in addition to the traffic ones. The Trig transponder accept NMEA as GPS input. That will be SIL=0.
Xtophe wrote:
Xtophe28-Oct-23 14:1552
Yeager wrote:
Are any of the available Traffic Collision Warning systems (such as PowerFlarm Fusion etc.) able to connect to the Trig TT31 (ADS-B out capable) Transponder and be used as the GPS source (SIL 0 or SIL 1+) for the Transponder?
The various “Flarm” boxes output the typical GPS NMEA messages on their output in addition to the traffic ones. The Trig transponder accept NMEA as GPS input. That will be SIL=0.
Great, that´s what I thought. I suppose SIL=0 is sufficient for European airspace. When in airspace with airliner type traffic (aircrafts that may omit SIL=0 ADS-B-IN aircrafts, in their setup) they will have you on their TCAS via Mode S anyways.
Would I be correct in assuming that even with a certified GPS antenna installation, connected to the eg. PowerFlarm Fusion, the signal the box sends to the transponder (Trig TT31 in my case), would still be SIL=0? or would the antenna installation determine the SIL number?
SIL=0 (many threads; do a search for “SIL=0” with the quotes) is visible only to “portable” receivers, not anything installed in the panel of any aircraft.
One day I will build a box which merges this data with SIL=2 data, to get around this – see here. I already have a product developed for another purpose which can do this.
Peter wrote:
Peter28-Oct-23 18:2354
SIL=0 (many threads; do a search for “SIL=0” with the quotes) is visible only to “portable” receivers, not anything installed in the panel of any aircraft.One day I will build a box which merges this data with SIL=2 data, to get around this – see here. I already have a product developed for another purpose which can do this.
Thank you. Interesting project you got going there! Sounds good.
As mentioned, “properly” equipped aircraft with panel mounted glass would likely have TCAS installed and see Mode S. I suspect that aircrafts equipped with ADS-b-IN, and no TCAS installed, would accept SIL=0 aircraft for display. I don´t know, but seems logical. Anyways, SIL=1 shouldn´t be hard to archive if that becomes a requirement in EU airspace at some point. SIL=0 is better than nothing.
Sadly that is not correct. I think I posted this further back.
Peter wrote:
Peter28-Oct-23 19:2856
Sadly that is not correct. I think I posted this further back.
Not that it matters much, but I looked back and don´t find any on this.
“Sadly that is not correct.” – Are you referring to commonly used installations in GA aircrafts (such as Garmin etc.) not allowing the operator to display SIL=0 aircraft?
Off topic I know but:-
Since making a move towards the ultralight side of ga I have found myself being introduced to several technologies I either didn’t know anything about or simply ignored as (and I am ashamed to say this) just being for the ULM scene.
The latest thing I’ve been introduced to is SafeSky TAS.
I can view traffic on my tablet in a split screen alongside Skydemon or SDVFR and I can also get audio warnings of traffic.
You need a smartphone or at least simcard which connects to ground stations and you see the same traffic as ATS sees.
The smartphone also acts as a sort of transponder (maybe not quite accurate but then I do know that all bicycles in the Tour de France are fitted with transponders and the teams can monitor their riders in a similar manner to SafeSky).
Yes you do need to be able to get a mobile connection to the ground station, but the claim is that 80% of Europe now have a connection up to 5000ft (I cannot verify this its SkySafe blurb).
They also claim that by 2025 they will also be connected to a satellite service so the coverage will be a lot greater and to all normal GA flight levels.
French ,ULM and free are synonymous, although this is Belgian free software.
I wonder if owners in the ULM world in Europe will be prepared to spend a great deal of money fitting costly TAS systems when you can get this free with the promise of greater things to come.
Maybe we could also get live onboard weather this way.🙂
SafeSky uses the same principle as PilotAware – getting the traffic info from the ground. Although PAW does it slightly better as the reception of their ground signal is better at altitude.
Yeager wrote:
Yeager28-Oct-23 19:5557
Peter wrote:
Peter28-Oct-23 19:2856
Sadly that is not correct. I think I posted this further back.
Not that it matters much, but I looked back and don´t find any on this.
“Sadly that is not correct.” – Are you referring to commonly used installations in GA aircrafts (such as Garmin etc.) not allowing the operator to display SIL=0 aircraft?
@Peter, yeah I see you´ve had your fair share of ADB concerns back in 1018-19, in another thread.
It is indeed ridiculous, if in fact there are rather simple, but well avionics equipped, aircrafts flying around without having SIL=0 traffic displayed.
In Europe I don´t see the financial incentive to install a certified GPS receiver and GPS antenna, just so that airplanes, with system capabilities of displaying ADS-B SIL=0, that have selected to NOT display these, can “see me”.
Flying VFR on a modest, but certified, aircraft there are other tools and toys I´d want to install or upgrade. A certified GPS installation (to get SIL=3) adds “no value” for my VFR (only) certified airplane – SkyDemon give me the best possible data I need for VFR navigation (in addition to my always up-to-date paper chart 20kg bag (NOT)). I´ll provide SIL=0 via a mode S transponder but that´s about as much as give.
See e.g. here.
You can’t radiate an “uncertified” ABS-B OUT signal (SIL=0) via a Mode S TXP.
This is nothing to do with Powerflarm however.
See also “Threads possibly related to this one” below, especially this one.
I get quite cynical about a lot of this stuff. It’s been marketed at people who don’t know the limitations and who think they buy Box X and
The business models are mostly bogus too, relying on hardware sales forever supporting data re-transmission facilities, and on people not realising that at any realistic altitude they won’t get the signal anyway.
In reality, straight old Mode C (or Mode C/S) has the highest penetration in the population, but no cheap box shows azimuth on these (with the demise of Zaon).
