I think we’re all dancing in the head of a pin here. Whether it customs or immigration doesn’t matter all that much. I think we all agree that a flight from Switzerland to France requires using an airport in both Switzerland and France that offer these facilities and that there has been no change in this area recently.
This fact does not mean that there had been any change in the Schengen agreement and certainly does not mean that it’s being dismantled.
Aviathor wrote:
why he thought it was OK to fly from LSGG to LFEY (airfield that has neither customs or immigration)
He came from Lausanne, which has both (PPR) but the problem was LFEY. Had he indeed come from Geneva AND done a customs and immigration into France there, there would not have been a problem.
Flyingfish wrote:
I know from having flown from within Schengen (LSGL) to inside Schengen (LFEY).
dublinpilot wrote:
I think we all agree that a flight from Switzerland to France requires using an airport in both Switzerland and France that offer these facilities and that there has been no change in this area recently.
Correct.
The thing which does rise some problems is that most small airfields in Switzerland can actually be flown to / from to destinations within Schengen but only those, while non-Schengen flights need a full fledged AoE. Pre-Schengen, this distinction was not made and the airfields which had a PPR customs also had immigration, which they now have lost. Again, for those not savvy in these matters, the safe way is to use a full AoE.
dublinpilot wrote:
Whether it customs or immigration doesn’t matter all that much.
It does! That’s the whole point of this thread IMO.
I think we all agree that a flight from Switzerland to France requires using an airport in both Switzerland and France that offer these facilities and that there has been no change in this area recently.
A flight from Switzerland to France requires airports that offer exactly one of the two facilities, namely customs. Whether they offer immigration is totally irrelevant for such a flight.
Peter wrote:
Check any database used by professionals e.g. Jeppesen.
Jeppesen is an American product and the US is not a member of either a customs or an immigration union, so for them there is no distinction.
The vast majority of the world’s professional pilots fly with Jepp data. It is only light GA which, to save money, uses the free AIP data.
But as always these one-liners drastically over-simplify the picture…. professional pilots usually get the handler to advise whether a flight is possible and to arrange any govt services.
present day Europe hosts the world’s only large scale immigration and customs unions, with mostly overlapping, but slightly different memberships.
That’s pretty accurate 
I think what is hard is keeping track of all the changes.
This…
Peter wrote:
Also, in international aviation terminology, the word “Customs” means Customs+Immigration. Very few countries separate the two.
and this…
Peter wrote:
but the Q was whether you get one or the other but not both services provided at any particular airport
are two different statements.
The first one is inaccurate. Many, if not all, countries separate the two. As has been stated above, even if executed by the same agency, they are handled independently. You can see this at any airport! It’s different processes you’re going through. Immigration is usually before you pick up your luggage. Customs checks will take place after retrieving your baggage.
The second statement (which is not really the question that lead to this thread…) deals with the question if there is many airports that only provide one or another and if you may possibly treat them as one and the same thing for GA purposes (as done by “non-rest-of-world-aware” Jeppesen, a private US-based company). For all practical purposes, many airports (see: Ports of Entry, as correctly pointed out by Urs) provide both because they are both REQUIRED. Usually, these airports also provide toilet facilities. That’s not because using the restroom and customs and immigration are somehow related. All of these are required for very independent reasons.
Peter wrote:
That is fairly unusual and doesn’t seem to exist outside Europe
As has been stated, the European Union and the fragmented treaties with surrounding non-member states leads to this pretty unique situation, yes.
dublinpilot wrote:
Whether it customs or immigration doesn’t matter all that much.
That very thought lead the OP to pay a 1200 EUR fine…
I think we all agree that a flight from Switzerland to France requires using an airport in both Switzerland and France that offer these facilities
No, I disagree.
A flight from Switzerland to France requires you to clear customs. A flight from Schengen member Switzerland to Schengen member France requires no immigration. This is by no means a theoretical distinction only and it shouldn’t be dismissed lightheartedly.
dublinpilot wrote:
that there has been no change in this area recently.
That I agree with!
Patrick wrote:
Usually, these airports also provide toilet facilities. That’s not because using the restroom and customs and immigration are somehow related. All of these are required for very independent reasons.
ROFL!!! Lovely that one! Still, some people may be quite happy to know that there is one nearby when dealing with the former.
Patrick wrote:
A flight from Switzerland to France requires you to clear customs. A flight from Schengen member Switzerland to Schengen member France requires no immigration. This is by no means a theoretical distinction only and it shouldn’t be dismissed lightheartedly.
Absolutely correct. Nevertheless, for those who seem to have problems with this distinction, a full blown AoE may be the better solution.
Patrick wrote:
The second statement (which is not really the question that lead to this thread…) deals with the question if there is many airports that only provide one or another and if you may possibly treat them as one and the same thing for GA purposes (as done by “non-rest-of-world-aware” Jeppesen, a private US-based company)
Geographic Europe (including the EU) is 6.7% of the world’s landmass, not the “rest of the world”, and I could imagine Jeppesen wouldn’t be overly concerned about defining over-complex details in a small geographic area… unless their paying market demanded it.
Patrick wrote:
As has been stated, the European Union and the fragmented treaties with surrounding non-member states leads to this pretty unique situation, yes.
Indeed. With respect to the complexity of these issues in a small geographic area, unique would be one way to describe it 
Past TBO would be another
Silvaire wrote:
With respect to the complexity of these issues in a small geographic area, unique would be one way to describe it
Europe is unique. There is no other place with so many different cultures and languages, and there have been wars here continuously since way before the dawn of the human race. Also, these different cultures and languages seldom follow country borders.
It’s not complicated at all, and rather natural when you live in the midst of it. Historically people have always moved around freely in Europe, passport and citizenship is a relatively new “invention”, within the last 1-200 years or so. Before that, Europe simply was a place with lots of different cultures and languages and lots of Kings and Queens, literally, and in many ways it still is Taxes and some sort of customs have existed since the human race started forming civilizations.
