Imagine if I had to have an app installed or set up an account and provide my personal data to every chain of gas stations, as well as the independent ones.
That’d be hilarious, almost like flying in some countries.
gallois wrote:
What do you mean nope.
I referred to you wrote that Tesla sockets “are the USA CHAdeMO”, and the overall assertion that plugs are the problem. In general, plugs / sockets are not the big problem in Europe (anymore).
I completely agree with you that the nonsensical fragmentation of payment systems and the refusal to accept chip-and pin or contactless payment at every charger are a massive obstacle. It may work within a country (and consolidators help), but once you go past the “crease in the map”, you can be stumped. On a recent trip, I was unable to charge in ANY of the chargers I tried to use Germany and the Netherlands. Not an issue in my case as I can use the Tesla superchargers and charged at my parent’s home overnight, but it could have left others stranded.
My wife jokingly says whenever we plan to use a non-Tesla charger (which is connect and go) to allow 10 minutes for general cursing, swearing and overall faff and the possiblility of it not working. I believe my success rate using chargers abroad is now below 50 percent, for a variety of reasons such as app not working, payment only possible using local cards or having an address in country, and similar nonsense.
Mooney_Driver wrote:
there should be a proper introduction done by the seller, to get the people started out with the right packages to make their charging as easy as it gets.
The EU Regulation demanding the ability to pay at point of sale using a credit or debit card is the right way to go. They really should also prohibit price discrimination based on payment method used as well. Voluntary subscriptions are fine, but should not be forced.
Here is a bit of irony: one of the chargers I tried to use was in a multi-storey car park in Germany. I could pay for the parking using a UK chip-and-pin credit card. No app, or local payment method required, no subscription to sign up etc.
You’re right about the Tesla chargers, I got a little confused with what people were telling us in our stressed out state. My brain hurt🙂
I don’t understand why as they are starting with a blank sheet of paper regarding commercial chargers why on earth you can’t either use chip and pin or even contact less. I wouldn’t even mind a universal RFID card or key ring. I would even be prepared to pay by smartphone. I wont comment on that just that I see lot of people flashing their phone instead of a credit card.🙂
It surely cannot be beyond today’s technology. Travel wise or revolut would also be a way. I just don’t understand why whoever it is wants to make it so difficult to drive around continental Europe (I include UK) in an EV.
And why can’t they also have a screen which gives the unit price and counts the flow like a petrol pump does. Surely they don’t have to reinvent the wheel to do it.
I just don’t understand why whoever it is wants to make it so difficult to drive around continental Europe (I include UK) in an EV.
In the UK there isn’t much demand for EV charging points. A bit of a chicken and egg argument probably… I mean the demand is there but the users struggle so much and I don’t see many more going in because of the generally mega low customer satisfaction. My neighbour (Kona EV) has been charging parked on my drive, via a mains cable thrown over the hedge. There is IMHO a risk that one day the whole market sector where people rely on public points will just suddenly collapse. It is already heading that way, in the ratio of vehicles to chargers.
Reading the above, it is much worse than I ever realised.
I guess all the EV evangelists are charging at home, and then yes it is a workable model. But the great majority of the European population – especially the poorer S Europe – can’t do that.
I’m ‘over’ any interest in EVs that I might’ve had in relation to my own use, but its interesting watching people flail with EV ‘issues’ as I avoid them.
My neighbor who last year spent some large sum on converting her house to full solar including batteries for night time car charging now tells me she thinks the battery management technology is “not there”… she can’t get the battery system to work properly despite many visits from the solar people. Obviously there’s a natural gas fired powerplant running not far away to charge her car at night, and that’s what’s doing it.
gallois wrote:
I don’t understand why as they are starting with a blank sheet of paper regarding commercial chargers why on earth you can’t either use chip and pin or even contact less. I wouldn’t even mind a universal RFID card or key ring. I would even be prepared to pay by smartphone. I wont comment on that just that I see lot of people flashing their phone instead of a credit card.🙂
Actually, you can work like this as much as I understand, simply pay with your creditcard or charge card by one supplyer and accept the roaming charges. The trouble then is, that you will pay much more than those who get “memberships” with various companies. A bit like loyalty programs for fuel as well, I for instance pay up to 5 cents less for my fuel per liter due to two of those I have cards for who give their own cardholders those 5 cents discount per liter as opposed to those who pay with a normal credit card. So also I do restrict myself to 2 fuel chains, but never found this restrictive. One other guy who drives a Fiat 500e tells me he has a total of two cards by two suppliers which he got at the dealership he bought the car from and never had the need for more. He also uses them via their individual apps but has both of them as PoI’s on his navigator.
Silvaire wrote:
My neighbor who last year spent some large sum on converting her house to full solar including batteries for night time car charging now tells me she thinks the battery management technology is “not there”… she can’t get the battery system to work properly despite many visits from the solar people.
That is not unknown, she should get someone else to look at it. Pal of mine near here got his problems sorted after a 3 month ordeal with a incapable installer by a guy who does the stuff properly within 2 hours of him stepping into his home, with the existing equipment. It was simply hooked up wrongly. Up to then, the batteries would charge only to about 40-50% capacity, now they are charging up to 80% which is the desired load. He uses the power for both powering a small EV and to keep his whole house powered. Since they work properly he also exports power to the grid and get’s paid (measly) for it.
Not my problem 
I pay more monthly for water than electricity and gas, getting that metered and billed correctly was my problem last week so now I can think about more enjoyable things. It’ll need attention again in another 35 years.
A close relative bought a new Tesla just over 3 years ago. It was one of the really fast ones where you pay for the software upgrade for a quicker 0-100Km acceleration.
He presently has 4 x old slightly bent alloy wheels in his garden due to hitting potholes….potholes not kerbs. The tyres are really low profile and fat. He is on his 3rd set of tyres which cost £ 250 each. So that’s £ 3,000 on tyres so far. He admits that his heavy car wears tyres quite quickly.
My second hand 16 valve small petrol car cost £ 2,900 6 years ago and even with servicing, my car costs less to run than his tyre consumption!
That also ignores his eye-watering costs of depreciation and his bent alloy wheels! I think I’ll stick to my cheap (fun to drive) run-around!
Tesla appears to be considering firing about 10% of their workforce. So it appears they are not the success they would like to be, now that there is serious competition.
Tesla was a lifestyle product for the early Yuppies who were willing to put their money into unknown tech. And no question, they have been the ones to make EV’s a “want have” by a considerable share of society.
However, now their honeymoon as the quasi monopolist is over and there are many competitors, most of them massively cheaper and less intrusive. I guess Tesla has to get used to be one of many rather than the only one.
