Practicalities of using the UK IR(R) while leaving the UK FIR

You don’t have to be IFR to be in clear air above a solid under-cast….so no need to descend through and get below…and if you do need to descend in those circumstances, you may find that a hole appears just where you need it…but clearly droning on in IMC is not a good idea…

So what would you do ?

Turn back instead of pressing on doing an illegal cloud break. Too many people have died doing this.

One of the objectives of the UK IMC rating was to assist with cloudbreak. It is not illegal in UK FIR..

Obviously the right answer is that you have to remain VMC when outside UK airspace

So you are supposed to ensure the foreign destination is forecast to be VFR, including the descent. And if it turns out to not be when you get there, the correct legal way is to either (a) divert somewhere where there is a genuine hole in the cloud, or (b) declare a Mayday and then you can use the IMCR skills to land on an ILS or whatever (and draw a huge amount of attention and possibly trouble).

The “turn back” is usually not an option because most planes can’t fly back to the UK from say S. France.

The problem is that unless you use the Mayday option, you cannot request an IFR clearance because – as an IMCR pilot – you probably won’t know the “Eurocontrol IFR” (misleadingly called “airways” in the UK) terminology, so ATC can catch you out. I had a situation with a departure, many years ago, where I was stuck under OVC010 at a Class D airport (outside the UK and with 1200ft VFR minima) for several days, and I tried to file an IFR flight plan to get out of there, using some IFR waypoints like one does in UK Class G. I had the IMCR and was very current with it, but not the IR. ATC “obviously knew” I didn’t have an IR; they could tell from the filed route, and they just kept saying “this is not a valid IFR flight plan” without in any way suggesting what they thought I was doing wrong. If I was the ATCO I would have just told the pilot “look, to depart IFR you need the full IR and then you can file a Eurocontrol flight plan” but for whatever reason they didn’t want to say anything. Maybe “this is not a valid IFR flight plan” was the limit of the guy’s ELP, which is wholly possible. Bizzarely when I did the JAA IR they never taught me how to do valid Eurocontrol routes; it was all planned off the IFR chart, so what I was doing at this airport was just that

As for doing it “practically”, and illegally, what I used to do in my pre-IR days was to fly VMC on top (all my early VFR trips were done VMC on top, with oxygen if required) and then if there was an overcast I would descend through the cloud over the sea. Usually it is really obvious how to do this safely, and obviously coastal airports are by far the best for it. Same in the UK for DIY descents to airports with no IAP; you need much bigger balls to do DIY approaches inland (the correct way is to carefully design the IAP, and the missed approach, from topo charts etc). You know the cloudbase is say 2000ft with 10km+ vis so you won’t hit the water. The best way to do such a cloudbreak is on the changeover from enroute ATC to the airport tower, when you are still OCAS, so by the time you call up the tower you are fully VFR. You can’t do this in Switzerland, etc And obviously you need to be fully IFR capable, with a good and fully working aircraft.

BTW, before c. 2011 when UK / JAA PPL holders had to be within sight of the surface under VFR, the possession of the IMCR / IR(R) removed that restriction. That was really useful for touring. Also it reduced the JAA 3000m min VFR vis to 1500m. These benefits were valid worldwide.

Peter wrote:

So you are supposed to ensure the foreign destination is forecast to be VFR, including the descent. And if it turns out to not be when you get there, the correct legal way is to either (a) divert somewhere where there is a genuine hole in the cloud, or (b) declare a Mayday and then you can use the IMCR skills to land on an ILS or whatever (and draw a huge amount of attention and possibly trouble).

What you describe is the risk inherent to VFR on top (as it is called in Europe). The fact that the pilot has a valid IR(R) makes him safe to perform the cloud break, but not legal to rely on it in his flight planning.

I would plan my flight so that I could conduct it in VMC conditions at destination. If the conditions turned out not to be VMC I would inform ATC about my predicament and ask for vectors to break clouds or perform an approach to a suitable airport.

I would not declare an emergency but ATC might treat it as such. I would tell them I am instrument rated (although my rating is not valid outside U.K.)

I would certainly not worry about any aftermath because I did my due diligence beforehand and have the paperwork to prove it. Going by the book creates less stress and hence is safer.

I would inform ATC about my predicament

In fluent French sure, but in English? What ELP4 compliant terminology would be recommended for that? I say that only partly tongue in cheek, because if they misunderstand you may get the police turn you over after landing, and in France they can impose an on the spot fine against which there is no (practical) appeal. Or you might get this. Using conversational English can be very tricky. This is not just my opinion; I went to a NATS presentation a while ago where they really hammered this point. I tend to sometimes not use standard phrases and then regret it. Obviously one has to judge this on the spot but if e.g. a French ATC person cannot record a legible ATIS (whose vocabulary is close to zero) he/she isn’t likely to understand an explanation of some predicament. I have heard countless cases of a Brit flying in France with the same conversational English they use back home, and the ATCO’s response made it pretty obvious that he/she understood almost none of it. That is standard procedure i.e. where ELP is insufficient the fallback position is minimal response (or zero response in Spain ).

As I see it, there is no legal difference between

• doing an illegal cloud break like I described, or
• landing using any procedure short of declaring a Mayday

i.e. both are illegal.

Obviously, in such a situation I would do the first one, because there is really no possible comeback on it, regardless of what ATC thinks you did

But if say your wx forecasts turned out to be well off and the cloudbase is OVC006 (which is easily possible; I got exactly that 1 week ago*) then you have just 2 options

• pull off a confident lie and ask for an IFR clearance (you don’t need to know about STARs etc, IME, if you are doing it from fairly close to the destination)
• declare a Mayday and request the ILS

* EGKA 090720Z 02002KT 9999 FEW020 10/09 Q1020
TAF EGKA 090725Z 0907/0915 VRB05KT 9999 SCT025 PROB30 0907/0909 8000 BECMG 0909/0912 26010KT PROB30 TEMPO 0909/0913 8000 -RADZ BKN014

and during the flight from Menorca it became

EGKA 091320Z 22009KT 9999 BKN006 16/15 Q1018
TAF AMD EGKA 091154Z 0912/0919 24008KT 9999 SCT045 TEMPO 0912/0914 3500 -RADZ BKN007

IOW, a change from perfectly flyable VFR wx to ILS-only wx.

What ELP4 compliant terminology would be recommended for that? I say that only partly tongue in cheek, because if they misunderstand you may get the police turn you over after landing, and in France they can impose an on the spot fine against which there is no (practical) appeal.

C’mon. I speak English to ATC all the time and I never revert to French. Controllers are supposed to understand and speak/understand English at B2 or C1 level and they do.

You cannot use much ELP compliant terminology (no more than French). That is why during the ELP exam you are tested on how well you are able to explain a random emergency situation. And the examiners at the DGAC are pretty damned close to native English speakers.

Also, contrary to what you may have been led to believe, France is not a police state.

Honesty has always worked much better for me than lies.

Just keep it simple. Don’t tell your life’s story. Hopefully there is no risk of immediate danger to anyone so declaring an emergency is not necessarily warranted since you are supposedly capable of a letdown. You could try
N113AC VFR on top. Unable to descend VMC. IMC rated pilot. Request radar vectors and descent to x thousand feet, or request ILS Rwy x at… LFXX

What will probably happen, especially at smaller airports where they are less used to using English, is that the controller will try to verify that he has understood you correctly by assembling a couple of questions in non-phraseology English and propose a course of action. He/she may treat it as an emergency – I do not know.

In any event, unless the weather was forecast as crap and you took off regardless, you’ll get a pat on the shoulder, well done.

Flying to Bled, Slovenia 2 weeks ago we were at FL110 being vectored by Italian ATC towards Ljubljana CTR. We were on top and the forecast at LJLJ was OVC 3900 ft BKN2000 FEW 200.
We cancelled IFR with Ljubljana and asked for vectors for a cloud break ILS approach which I broke off at 2000 ft being clear of cloud and continued VFR at 2000ft on a runway heading to Bled. Worked perfectly and ATC were incredibly helpful after we requested to do exactly this. At least a few other people (there was a Comanche Fly in) did the same in our group. I had never done (or requested) anything like this before but was with a much more experienced pilot in my plane who knew the area very well. The only difference I can see is that I have a valid IR, but legally I assume I am VFR on an ILS in this case right? The reason for canceling was that we obviously didn’t want to fly the missed approach since we knew we’d be VFR below the clouds.

LFHNflightstudent wrote:

…but legally I assume I am VFR on an ILS in this case right?

Yes. But then, legally, when flying under visual flight rules you are obliged to observe visual meteorological conditions. And if these are not met you either have to obtain an IFR clearance (which you implicitly may have gotten by the controller who cleared you for the cloud break) or discontinue the approach. With only the UK IR(R) it is doubtful if (legally…) you can accept an IFR clearance outside the UK, even if only for cloud breaking.

I have done so many of these cloud breaks and nobody ever asked questions so I never had to answer any. And this is how it should be.