In the US pilots and ATC frequently use “x out of y” for level changes. Yesterday I heard several times Lufthansa use the same phrase. My understanding was that this is US style and discouraged in Europe. I can’t recall to have heard it before in Europe and so I’m curious. Has something changed or was that just a Lufthansa pilot with too much flying in the US? :-)
Poor RT in the States as well as here. “Passing FL190 descending one-zero thousand” works everywhere and can’t be misinterpreted. “Squawk 1234 coming down” is another bad one and so is “G-ABCD with you” on a frequency change.
Rant over, sorry!
“one-zero thousand” works everywhere…
If I wanted to be nitpicking, I would say that in most parts of Europe this would not work. Transition levels are usually much below FL100, so “one-zero thousand” woluld rather be “flight level one one zero” 
But honestly, I have few issues with non-standard RT. After all, it only complements what ATC already knows from the control strips (or whatever their electronic replacement is called now) and transponder readouts on their screen. Sitting down there – or up here – all day, a non-standard phrase every now and then adds a little variety to the daily boredom. Neiter we nor ATC staff are robots and a little human thing from time to time reminds us of that fact.
I deliberately chose “one-zero thousand” as a US example.
woluld rather be “flight level one one zero”
Or even “flight level one hundred” :-)
I’m afraid RT is not there to add a little variety to our lives. Most of the world’s pilots and ATC are using English as a second language, that’s why standard phraseology is so important.
Try varying the script in Asia, you won’t even get a reply!
one-zero thousand” works everywhere and can’t be misinterpreted.
In the UK it has been for many years Flight Level “One Hundred”; the reason was that it was missinterpreted and lead to a large number of level busts. Because of the success of FL One Hundred, they also introduced Two hundred and Thrree Hundred. CAP 413 Ch3 Page 2
4. When transmitting messages containing flight levels each digit
shall be transmitted separately. However, in an endeavour to
reduce ‘level busts’ caused by the confusion between some
levels (100/110, 200/220 etc.), levels which are whole hundreds
e.g. FL100, 200, 300 shall be spoken as “Flight level (number)
HUN DRED”. The word hundred must not be used for headings.
I’m afraid RT is not there to add a little variety to our lives.
Agreed, that’s not its primary goal, but if both sides are up to the job than a little bit of human touch will not do any harm.
E.g. on departures from our homebase, one of my co-pilots likes to call “Langen Radar, Callsign, passing three – fo(u)r – five” (instead of the correct tounge-twister: “passing altitude three thousand feet climbing altitude fife thousand feet” by which time our little homesick angel will have busted the 5000ft anyway…). But he is a special case because chances are high that he will be talking to his wife who sits at the other end 
We use to have regular “pilot-controller-meetings” around here (anybody is invited, but you have to register so that enough food&drink can be arranged http://www.pilot-controller-meeting.rocks/) where items like phraseology and procedures are discussed in a casual atmoshpere. These people are normal humans and like to be treated as such. But it doesn’t matter much, because with ADS-B and datalink, talking to humans over the radio will be a thing of the past very soon.
Just to clarify, I used “Passing FL190 descending one-zero thousand” as an example to include a flight level and an altitude in the same call. Of course, in most of the world, you would say “flight level one-zero-zero” and in the UK “flight level one hundred”.
Standards, huh!
Just to clarify, I used “Passing FL190 descending one-zero thousand” as an example to include a flight level and an altitude in the same call.
Shouldn’t it be “passing flight level one niner zero, descending altitude ten thousand”? Meaning the “altitude” has to be mentioned to distinguish it from flight level. Sometimes ATC in Germany put a lot of emphasis on “altitude” and insist on the read back.
Er, yes!
In the US pilots and ATC frequently use “x out of y” for level changes. Yesterday I heard several times Lufthansa use the same phrase. My understanding was that this is US style and discouraged in Europe
It’s discouraged in the US as well. In the US the correct way to say it is “X descending Y” or “X climbing Y” or “level X”.
