Before spending the £££ on a full-blown pre-purchase Inspection, I suggest that you do a detailed review of the aircraft’s maintenance records.
A very detailed study of the full maintenance records can tell you a whole lot about the state of the aircraft . Since Cirrus issued a very substantial list of Service Bulletins a survey of those that were carried out or not will give a good idea as to the level of attention and £££ that was spent on a given acft.
(Or better: buy a Columbia right away!)
Flyer59 wrote:
(Or better: buy a Columbia right away!)
Great Idea ! 
So they sell 7 in 2015 ;-)
What a story… but as Gordon Gekko said “greed works”
And you aren’t the only one I know who got massively emotionally attached to a plane and bought it regardless of dodgy stuff staring them in the face.
Yes you can fake a C88 but it would take more than 5 mins. Whereas a sales invoice is just the company letterhead – 5 mins in photoshop. But, seriously, what would happen if you point blank asked the Cirrus dealer to supply a C88/IM4? I tried it with Air Touring but it was about 2 years after I bought it; they fobbed me off. My understanding is that the document reveals how much the dealer paid for it, so they don’t like to give them out.
I don’t think anybody knows the full extent of any problems which may one day surface on the VAT front. It is certainly a hostage to fortune, especially if you land in another country and they decide to do a VAT docs check.
I have heard many stories, some of which were quite worrying e.g. the one about the TBM700 which landed at Tarbes LFBT and the owner had to pay the VAT on it. One version of it is that he got the VAT back when he departed some days later. I have been reliably told the story is essentially true but never found out the detail. For example he may have been an EU passport holder who imported and then kept an N-reg plane in the EU for more than X months – that is a NO-NO. Socata would not comment on it (I did ask). But most pilots who did get trouble don’t go public with it.
I think if I was buying a plane I would get this aspect right because you won’t get an opportunity to fix it later.
Well, you can always “fix it” by paying the VAT on the current MV and then you get a document from Customs saying VAT has been paid. I personally know someone who did exactly that, on an N-reg whose history was unknown. It was an old IFR SEP and I think they paid about 5k to get that document. The bottom line is that you discount the price by 20%, in the absence of VAT documents.
Flyer59 wrote:
If the aircraft was bought from a European Cirrus dealer then its easy to prove because the dealer has sold it + VAT and has the documents.
What if it was bought by a VAT registered entity? I would’ve thought this opens the doors to the possibility of selling the plane without VAT to an entity outside of the EU. If it were ever to return, VAT would have to be payed again.
Yes, or even to an entity within the EU which supplies a VAT number; then the seller doesn’t have to charge VAT. This entity could then export it out of the EU, formally or de facto.
There are multiple ways to break the VAT linkage from the original dealer’s invoice (or documents).
And that’s a fair point – the C88/IM4 becomes worthless IF your Customs people get evidence of a subsequent export out of the EU. AIUI, the VAT becomes due every time the aircraft gets imported – even if it was imported and the import VAT paid before.
So it looks like some due diligence is needed on where it has been.
Yes but to export a plane requires a formal export notification. It doesn’t mean flown out of the EU.
Yes but to export a plane requires a formal export notification. It doesn’t mean flown out of the EU.
If I fly mine to the USA, live there for 5 years, and then fly it back, there is no issue with import VAT?
I don’t know, but equally I am not sure.
Rob2701 wrote:
check valid title, finance o/s liens etc
For the D-Reg you can check any liens on an aircraft by calling the district court (Amtsgericht) in Braunschweig, and ask them about aircraft liens of the registered aircraft. You don’t need more than the registration sign and they will tell you if there is any open lien on the aircraft. The phone number is +49 531 488 0
