Advice concerning Piper Lance

The MX20 is not supported anymore by Garmin. So if it is dead, it is dead!
Replacing with one found on ebay should cost you something like USD1000-1500.

The Apollo CNX80 (same as Garmin GNS480) is not 8.33Khz. So you will need to replace it or replace the KX155 if you want 8.33Khz (what is becoming a must have if you want to travel in Continental Europe). So expect some expenses on the radio and transponder front if you want to fly somewhere.

What is worth $$$ is a working autopilot. If the STEC55X is working fine, that’s already a good start.

If the engine/prop has been overhauled recently and the plane got decent avionics like the STEC, SANDEL, CNX80, MX20, the previous owner(s) should have been happy with it. So if it fits your mission profile, the pre-purchase is positive and the price is decent, it seems to be a good choice. Knowing that you will need to invest upgrading its avionics.

Yes, miles out.

Good summary by ploucandco.

But still, the biggest issue remains: this airplane has apparently had major damage. Sounds like you have already met the owner and still he hasn’t told you about it. So there are two possibilities: 1. he doesn’t know either. 2. he deliberately doesn’t say the truth.

Both would be a good reason to run away.

IMHO : If the major damage was repaired along time ago, think when the aircraft was worth alot more and the insurance paid for a first rate repair, AND the inspection shows all was properly done, I wouldn’t give it a second thought.

Probably the cheapest way to get 8.33 will be to spend a few k $ on a overhauled KX165A. The KX155 connector will need rewiring. Jesse here is the man for that.

Get a MX20 on US Ebay – here’s one for $2800 and drop it in. It may need some dealer setup; I don’t know. Many US sellers won’t ship to the UK, too…

What about the accident- run a mile or look for a substantial discount?

A really good prebuy is needed. If it was properly repaired it will be good. But you need an expert because if e.g. the whole thing is bent by 2mm, it will never fly straight. Well, it will fly, but a few kt slower. If you have contemporary logbooks and they don’t show it, walk away, because the reason for not showing it can be only deliberate. Same with a blind date, in the era of the camera phone

But really I would not buy any used plane unless there was an opportunity to check for how much of the engine is in the oil filter – unless the price was discounted by the engine overhaul. Many will disagree with this, of course. The fresh oil is a bit of a coincidence, too…….. If I was selling mine now, with 15hrs on the oil, I would not change the oil just to impress you. They don’t call me “black hat” for no reason, but, very likely, you will find it has sat around for say a year without any flying, corroding nicely, and they just changed the oil. Not the first time that was done! I know of another plane which has done a really scarily low time in over 10 years and that came with fresh oil too. In fact IIRC it was for sale with 1 year old fresh oil and then the oil was changed again (without any flying having been done, as far as I could find out) on the buyer’s request, which was a mistake but it didn’t matter because the previous oil was fresh too.

If a seller wouldn’t tell me about such a history – i would not even think about buiying that aircraft. It’s just not fair. There’s enough possibilities to spend your money, you don’t need that.

If a seller wouldn’t tell me about such a history – i would not even think about buiying that aircraft. It’s just not fair. There’s enough possibilities to spend your money, you don’t need that.

Assuming this “seller” is the broker where it’s listed, I wouldn’t give any credit to ANYTHING they say about the plane because they probably don’t know squat about it !

The more basic thing is that if you buy a 1976 Lance for 50-60k, it isn’t going to be a mint specimen.

In this case I would do a bit of digging into why the repair isn’t listed, and walk away if anything dodgy is found.

If the logbooks go back only to say 2000, and the repair was 1996, then you also have to ask yourself why were the old logbooks “lost”? On this category of aircraft, one isn’t just going to lose them. Also their lack will devalue the aircraft massively because it takes only about 20 seconds to find that crash report.

Buying a plane with that kind of dodgy history (if it really can’t be checked out) is OK if you absolutely fall in love with it, have a few tens of k to throw at it if necessary, never want to sell it, and have an interesting attitude to risk. And you will have a hard time selling it. But falling in love with a Lance? No way. There used to be one where I am based – an old dog, always going wrong, and continually only just marginally avoiding a gear up landing due to persistent gear problems. Admittedly it was school owned so minimal maintenance…

I’ve never been afraid of some slight damage or even gear ups. Most older retractables have had some incident if they’ve been around long enough. Out of the three aircrafts I’ve owned, two have had gear ups. If it’s all been repaired well, I wouldn’t think twice. But the accident reports wording “struck a fence and spun 90 degrees” is the one thing that would make me nervous. Gear collapses is one thing, but a main spar that has been banged far out and in its weakest direction would be a concern. And if there’s no log entry of how that was inspected and repaired, I would not feel comfortable unless I’d had a very thorough inspection of that spar with Eddy current, flourescent light inspection or maybe even x-ray.