This is known as the “missile alley”, especially as under the current crazy CAA bust them all infringement policy more than 50% of PPLs fly with their transponder OFF.
I’ve done it a few times… years ago.
The CAA are proposing to change the Manchester LLR (a low level route, currently class D airspace with some ‘special rules’ – you don’t have to contact ATC being the most prominent, amongst others) that runs between Manchester and Liverpool’s class D surface areas.
In summary, the CAA proposes to:
Generally a pretty good improvement over the current LLR, which is already a very useful route to avoid having to get a zone transit from Manchester or when the weather isn’t great over the Pennines.
Consulation is here:
https://consultations.caa.co.uk/safety-and-airspace-regulation-group/proposed-amendment-to-mllr
Peter wrote:
This is known as the “missile alley”
I think “missile alley” is overegging the pudding a bit, while it’s busier than some random piece of class G airspace, and you can’t have your head inside, it’s never been THAT busy when I’ve gone through. The main reason I try to avoid it is the limited amount of vertical space (exacerbated by it always seeming to be thermic). I suspect most of the training traffic out of Barton tends to go to the north where things are a bit more open.
alioth wrote:
The main reason I try to avoid it is the limited amount of vertical space (exacerbated by it always seeming to be thermic).
Given that fact, I’m surprised there are no separate recommended flight paths for northbound and southbound traffic.
Airborne_Again wrote:
alioth wrote: The main reason I try to avoid it is the limited amount of vertical space (exacerbated by it always seeming to be thermic).Given that fact, I’m surprised there are no separate recommended flight paths for northbound and southbound traffic.
They’ve considered it and discounted the option as it will create pinch points where traffic converge thus increasing the risk of a MAC.
For me the LLR is just scary – you’ll struggle to maintain ground/obstacle clearance AND CAS clearance at the same time, the ground level is not 0 there, plus there are built-up areas.
I reckon I passed 10 aircraft last time I went there, of which I spotted maybe 1. And all would have been within 100ft of me vertically.
The alternatives are a long VFR detour, or IFR at ~FL100 plus (needs a full IR).
FL60/70 IFR normally works too.
Peter wrote:
The alternatives are a long VFR detour, or IFR at ~FL100 plus (needs a full IR).
Or a VFR zone transit. If you have a transponder that’s turned on you can get them off either Manchester or Liverpool (it’s been a while since I tried Liverpool though so I don’t know what it’s like now – last time was during the tail end of COVID where they were sometimes NOTAMed closed with airspace reverted to class G – I got no response at all on the radio despite them not being NOTAMed closed, so I went up the LLR in that instance). Manchester would typically have you fly the route of the LLR but above its ceiling at 1500’ (which when the LLR has its ceiling raised obviously will no longer be an option).
Another 200ft will be very welcome. Has anybody sat down and worked out whether it’s possible to fly it legally in terms of maintaining the ability to land clear of built-up areas at all times?
