Low Approach - SERA 3105/5005 - Germany

Italian ATC cleared me two times into airspace A while flying VFR. Should I now start to refuse such clearances, as VFR into A is officially not allowed?! That sounds ridiculous. The same for denying offers from German ATC for a low approach. I did several of them, including EDDF. Even Frankfurt TWR invites pilots sometimes to do some low approaches during quiet moments of the day, even when pilots didn’t initially ask for it.

According to the German forum, someone stated that an employee of FRAPORT did inform the authorities of some low approaches. Maybe because they don’t like traffic that doesn’t leave a single euro at the airport? Poor Fraport… They should take a look at EHAM (Amsterdam Schiphol), where even touch and go’s are free of charge if traffic permits to have some fun with Schiphol TWR.

It’s also typical German to have the idea that authorities have to “prosecute” as soon as they get a tip or hint. In the end, it’s always in the discretionary power of the authorities to prosecute something or not. I think RP Darmstadt (the competent authority of the EDDF area) should just ignore such hints and rather send the EASA a request to quickly change SERA as soon as possible.

I cannot see SERA rules for cross country flying minimum altitudes related to airfield approach airspace. Also ATC controls their airspace as it is their job to tell the pilots how they want you to behave within that space for deconfliction or so. Vic

vic wrote:

Also ATC controls their airspace as it is their job to tell the pilots how they want you to behave within that space for deconfliction or so

ATC rarely controls anything bellow SERA minimal altitudes
- For IFR you don’t even show on screens bellow 500ft & 2NM from threshold
- For VFR you rarely get controlled visually bellow 500ft & you may be bellow horizon, buildings or trees

For instance,
- You don’t get vectors & altitudes to fly bellow SERA minimal altitudes
- You get clearance to land but you can still go-around without clearance and inform ATC
- You get clearance to takeoff but you can still reject, land back without clearance and inform ATC

With exception of JFK, LAX & Heathrow & Frankfurt runways, the information on aircraft position near the ground “is not very reliable”, pilots tend to have a duty to report what they are doing when bellow “SERA min altitudes” as ATC can’t see everything or judge heights/headings near the ground (using their eyes or radars), so I am really not sure how this pilot got reported or caught? and what evidences were pulled and used against him? but something is fishy in his story !

Never wondered why ATC say “report short final”?

I mean ATC , not FIS, controlling aircraft in their airspace C, D, and in airport airspace , Air Traffic Control ! You follow their radio instructions when approaching an airport, no ? Vic

vic wrote:

You follow their radio instructions when approaching an airport, no ? Vic

I mean what kind of instructions or control you get from Air Traffic Control (in airspace C, D, and airport airspace) when you are bellow 500ft agl? do you get headings & altitudes to fly?

You only get clearances to takeoff/land/miss (or report ABC/xxxft, frequency change, or in UK “cleared for a low pass”)
It’s up to the PIC to decide on his flight path bellow 500ft agl

I have been cleared into A in Spain and Italy.

Years ago, of course

Of course I accepted, because both involved ridiculous airspaces with zero traffic.

Exactly, if all CAA’s would prosecute the same way, but they don’t… Even not in Germany. While RP Darmstadt makes the choice to prosecute this mentioned pilot with a 55€ fine for his low approach in EDDF, other RP’s could make the choice to not prosecute it at all. And again other CAA’s might send out big fines, how knows…

And honestly, if ATC clears me through his airspace, I don’t care if it is A, B, C or D… If he is fine with me being in his airspace, than it’s also fine for me. Why would I need to say something like: “Oh thanks a lot, but you know, your airspace is class A. VFR is not allowed in airspace A. Request to decent below your airspace.” I guess the controller would think that I’m on drugs with such a statement, or he thinks that I’m an ultra precisely German nitpicker.