Ibra wrote:
There are privately owned airfields that are licensed by DGAC (listed in AIP/VAC) and they are open to public transit (CAP)
I was emphasizing on this difference. “Privately owned” is almost meaningless because the majority of airfields are privately owned, and it indicates nothing about their status for flying. Big airports are privately owned and open to public transit. Administration airports are publicly owned but you can’t fly there.
When I say “private airfield”, I really mean “aérodrome à usage privé” – “private use”. In the law the precision is always made (“à usage privé”) but whenever language shortcuts are done, “private airfields” means “private use”, simply because “privately owned” is an almost useless category.
Take the CERFA form for instance. You ask for creation of “aérodrome privé”, and it actually means private use airfield.
It also makes sense in English, because “private” also means restricted to certain people, regardless of property status (like private quarters in a hotel, private information, etc.).
Original post edited to further clarify.
Got it, yes it’s usage that matters (not ownership) as far as DGAC is concerned about it’s use in terms of licensing (‘homologation’)
Actually, there are only two categories CAP and non-CAP 
For CAP airfields, it’s open to circulation publique and can have public transport, balisage, radio aids, night flying, controllers…if you want something more fun, the ramp is not part of “circulation aerienne” (only runways & taxiways are open to “circulation publique”). You may need permission from gestionnaire or owner to park and use the ramp
For non-CAP airfields,
You can bypass Restricted AD in VAC by getting waiver from DGAC
https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/id/LEGISCTA000048323062/2023-11-01
Ibra wrote:
You always need owner permission (or gestionnaire)
Not always. Some restricted airfields just want to impose some random rule (therefore cannot be open to CAP), but you can still fly there without authorization if you fit the right criteria. Those rules are written officially in the VAC so it’s worth reading even if it says restricted use.
For example, in Saintes air base, you don’t need any authorization if you are based less than 80nm away. For Etrepagny, you can only go if you’re based in a neighbor airfield (like Pontoise – I can freely do circuits there despite the restricted status).
Ibra wrote:
You may need permission from gestionnaire or owner to park and use the ramp
That’s crazy and could open up for a few interesting surprises ! But I suppose this would be subject to NOTAM or mentionned in the VAC.
I believe you can also have any number of navaids in restricted airports, maybe even offer charter services (if the air operator owns the whole facility). Normally this happens more for large corporations which have a private fleet for employees (read top management), so that would exclude charter, but in principle I think it’s possible.
Yes some are restricted to specific users who don’t need permission, also if you don’t fill the criteria you can still fly there with owner/dgac authorization (even if it says in VAC that is reserved for based and neighbors, there is a legal text somewhere)
maxbc wrote:
I believe you can also have any number of navaids in restricted airports, maybe even offer charter services (if the air operator owns the whole facility). Normally this happens more for large corporations which have a private fleet for employees (read top management), so that would exclude charter, but in principle I think it’s possible.
It is allowed in Restricted AD with AIP/VAC entry (majority are not certified for 5700kg though)
It is near impossible on Private Use AD: Chailley is one example who used to operate as you mentioned (top management of chicken factory), they had DGAC license to operate Falcon10 jets on private use runway (we are talking NCC/5700kg, they got ICAO code and even had private Boeing visiting). However, no lights and no nav aids as DSNA was not along: you can’t plot own vor and hire controllers !
https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI000006843811/2024-05-31
Funny enough, most of their problem were not in Chailley
https://aviation-safety.net/asndb/325163
https://aviation-safety.net/asndb/324369
The ability to install nav aids, night lights, markings….in private use airfields is still under discussion (they wanted to simplify or drop it all together), apparently Flying Taxis, eVTOL, Drones… love cozy lights at night with use of radio frequencies
For private airfield navaids you need the minister’s authorization directly, neat ^^
A more reasonable approach is upgrading to restricted first.
gallois wrote:
So maxbc it does depend what your aim is.
For me it’s using a SEP so the answer is the private airfield authorization (although the field is not 600m, it’s more like 400m with clear area on one side only, so not easy to operate or authorize – maybe a lightly loaded or STOL-modded 182 could work ; there are some similar private airfields with a single direction to land / takeoff)
For the OP the goal was using a ULM which is a lot simpler. In fact ULMs have already landed in our (unprepared) field.
Fortunately in France there is nearly always a way🙂
How about a Jodel or Maule?
Maule’s are few and far between in Europe (especially tricycle versions), and are not particularly efficient. Trying to find the right one could take years.
The big advantage of something like a 177RG or 182RG is that they have very good cruise behavior and efficiency while also being quite good at short fields (especially the 182).
Jodel might be a bit small (ideally reasonable legs with 4 people would be doable), but I’ll check them out since I don’t know them well.
You need to look at the D140 .
Ahh I have just re read your post. I don’t think there is a tricycle Mousquetaire.
You might look at some.of the Robin’s. Although.the newer ones are holding their price the older ones are sometimes very good value.
The Robin’s with the 180 + hp engines have cruising speeds between 125 and 140knts IAS ao not quick like a Mooney but are very capable of landing on grass. Good useful load in the region of 450kg. Range is usually just under 1000km approx 500NM.
Take off roll usually around 300metres with a climb of around 800ft per min at MTOW.
You may not like Robin aircraft but they are a very good starting point when comparing prices, capability, and performance with other aircraft to hone in on what’s important to you.🙂
A Cub (95hp-150hp) is more than enough for 200nm occasional trips, they do in/out of 300m easily
A Robin (180hp) is well equipped to go anywhere as long as one land it using proper short fields speeds and techniques
D140 (if you find one) or Maule (ideally MX7-235C), if you are into 4 seats bush flying: these are very exotic, something like C182 (maybe with STOL or King Katmai) is more standard and does everything
For trade-offs, one has to pick: drag or efficiency
Regarding landing on public space (not OP question), last Thursday beach landing using Cubs at LeTouquet was cancelled due to last minute opposition by Maritime Affaires (they manage sands of low tide), they are the 5th or 6th agency on signature ladder !
https://www.piperclubfrance.com/rdv/atterrissage-sur-la-plage-du-touquet/
In the meantime, why not try fixed wing ULM or Gyros?
