Robin DR401 as an IFR tourer

Hi

One more note on upgrades

The da40ng with the AE300 is fully maintained in the upgrades of g1000 software of garmin by diamond. Any development is instantly available for da40ng

Not so for thielert or TDI g1000 airframes of da 40. Diamond stopped the programs for maintaining an accurate software of the g1000 in these older airframes. No reason to speculate about why and when and how…but it’s just a fact.

Additionally the da40 ng has been certified in FAA land which obviously has a huge impact on future variants of g1000 systems (touchscreen)

Anyway…as for high altitude operations…anyone remembers the good old U2 spy plane. …
The wing ratio was needed to fly in 60000 ft with a low fuel burn. Just keep in mind that a mig29 can do this altitude as well but only for a few minutes until it’s fuel burn forces it back to base…

If you compare diamond and robin they have a complete different vision while designing their aircraft.

Robin 400 always was tailored for easy club flying with reliable forgiving characteristics and as a sexind role as a towing plane. Bugger variants of robin prooved to be nice touring planes, but high altitude never was an idea at all, hence the aerodynamic layout.

Diamond always wanted a cheap lean economic flying platform which, most of all, will give all these ATO a nice system solution, da20-40-42 was the logical cycle for the production, derived from glider production expertise. The huge wingspan and its wing ratio was an aerodynamically reasoned fact, for low drag and low fuel consumption.
The second advantage of these figures was for the second market target group…owner pilots who do business travels with their IFR diamonds…they idea…they fly high and fast…here the wing design prooved as well to be a good choice to meet these numbers…
Diamond later when designing the da40 and 42 thereafter was very proud that,their planes would easily go,up to 20000ft and perform around 145-180KTAS with 135-168hp!!!! And less than 6gal jet fuel. (42 obviously double)

That’s why TKS Wx radar and oxygen was in cooperated in the 42 and is currently on its way with the newly tested diesel SEP da50 (maybe market entry In 2018)

So I think the robin and the da40ng are not a good match when it comes to try to compare two planes. It’s like comparing a Mini Cooper with a Volkswagen Passat. Boths cars are good in exactly what they were designed for, and a mini is nice for city life and fun driving, and the Passat is perfect for long distance high way cruise…of course they are priced differently and of course you can use them vice verse as well…like Da40 and dr400… You can take a robin and do long trips to international runways of 5km length and put the da40 down on nice fresh cut gras strips of 350-500m. Theoretically perfectly fine. Practically maybe not so fun…

Anyway. As long as the da40ng is 100k€ more expensive to buy (okay with g1000 and gfc700 vs a g500 and a stec55x in a robin) the Beatle remains a good option…

I believe … Of course. Always a matter of taste

Hihi

I wanna see a dr400-180 performing at fl250 ;-)

POH never lie

Anyway. My point was that I think the two planes have different ideas to fullfill different mission…like I never saw a da40 used as a workhorse in the alps in pulling gliders to nice density altidudes… A lot of dr401 155cd are also used for towing gliders which underlines their performance, still. A travel IFR cruiser … That’s a very virgin role for a dr400, that wasn’t meant to make a ranking which plane is 1 or 2

Peter wrote:

How

The TC holder is communicating to garmin what kind of changes are needed or wanted. After being clear on do ability and price the new software is shipped to diamond and they test it. Afterwards it’s reported to garmin and the changes (updates) are sealed. For all systems application in this version, the update will be available. Obviously for the famous bucks, but certified and approved…

I don’t know in which way this is legally done and who holds the STC and if it’s a minor change approval ect.

Most importantly is…boths the airplane manufacturer, the engine manufacturer(in case of integrated systems like a g1000) and the avionics manufacturer need to be in line with each other and pull the same strings. Otherwise it’s a no go are. See diamond da40 and cd100 series with g1000

Irrespective of legality, can’t a Garmin dealer update a G500 or G1000 to the latest software?

They must be able to.

I know of N-reg planes which got the latest software, while EASA-reg ones with the same kit could not. What I don’t know is whether the former were done legally i.e. IAW the STC that was actually used to cover the install.

The g1000 also embeds the software for the engine. Whereas the g500 only displays and steers airframe related information (excluding the engine)

But EASA is very clear on changes with avionics…The TC holder is the master of ceremony, hence it all starts there. In principle if something is technically possible doesn’t mean that’s is automatically legal.

See the g500 upgrades of da40 tdi currently on the market…if there is a crash, or damage to be investigated I don’t want to be involved in the party, who made this frame fly…there is no TC approval by diamond, that’s allowing a g500 in a da40 tdi…but then again, welcome to Europe, where administration makes everything impossible or possible. It wouldn’t be the first time, that there is a legal approval for an installation, while its in fact not legal to do. In that case …you need a court to clear any doubt

Anyway…
This homemade and self made world is overtaking GA ppl world in light speed. Non certified parts for fun
Flying…

Isn’t the garmin g900 a good example,for that. UL or LAPL flying is a lot cheaper and everything which is technically possible is usually also okay to,do…any way..no IFR in this environment …

Reviving this thread again, tough not about the 401 series

Anyone flying wooden fabric DR400-160 or DR400-180 in IMC? or metal ones like the Robin R.1180 Aiglon?
(assuming the aircraft is left in the hangar, have decent IFR avionics)

I did my initial ppl training in these and flew most variants from 108hp to 180hp, I think they are really good machines for VFR flying
That was really while ago and never in clouds or rain, so I am not sure if they are good platform for IMC?
How capable a DR400-180 in light IMC compared to these benchmarks PA28 Archer/Arrow series, C172? or DA40?

I helped a DR-500 owner gain his EASA IR – nice aircraft, Piper Arrow performance with better range and useful load on fixed gear.

Very nice in IMC, not sure if flying through ice and heavy rain is recommended although the build quality is very good.

The DR400 is no problem in IMC, rain is not an issue……….. Ice is it will kill you in any aircraft that has not got the kit to shed it.