We are probably flying a PA31-310 (Piper Navajo) to the UAE (and back) within a few month, and we’re contemplating on the best routing and of course: Where to get AVGAS 100LL.
The aircraft:
The aircraft is a pretty standard Navajo, although with nacelle tanks (100 liters each) which gives us a total capacity of 900 liters. The fuel flow is around 130-140 liters an hour at around 165 knots. The aircraft has no weather radar, but it is otherwise well equipped.
Routing and AVGAS:
First thought is to get to Greece and then on to Cyprus, Israel and perhaps somewhere in between. As I understand, going from Turkey to Israel can be tricky. And of course, we need AVGAS 100LL. Any other ideas for routing?
Maintenance:
The aircraft has been commercially operated and is really well maintained. But of course, with a 40+ year old aircraft things will likely happen. Anyone with experiences here, either good or bad? Would be nice to avoid bringing our own mechanic or to fly a mechanic in.
Hi Erlend.
As you will probably route via Saudi or even Turkey, you will need overflight and landing permit.
I suggest you have a chat with Mike at WhiteRoseAviation. He’s doing all my permits and he his doing a lot of small planes so he has the info regarding AVGAS.
Have a great flight
I’m not aware of any permits for Turkey for private flights from ECAC member states; they require that one puts the nature of the flight (e.g. “PRIVATE FLIGHT”) in the RMK section of the FPL.
Israel needs prior permission / security clearance. See http://asoc.mot.gov.il/
The route between Turkey and Cyprus (on the way to Israel) requires some “special procedures” because (South Greek) Cyprus / ICAO on the one hand, and Turkey / North Turkish Cyprus on the other hand, do not agree on who controls what airspace. Nothing very very complicated, but be prepared. Do read the Jeppesen note on the subject and it should be clear.
The Israel permission is really hard to obtain. Among other things you need someone in Israel who will speak for you and they have to prove they have known you well for some time. I failed twice with two different people who I had met a few times, that was not enough for the security people. And the people who offered to spoeak for me were both prominent people (eg IDF Air Force colonel, large business owner etc).
My instructor just flew a Cirrus Jet to Australia. He routed Cyprus, Egypt, Saudi, UAE I believe. Egypt is the key point to get around problems in the ME.
General Aviation Support Egypt (GASE), https://www.gasupportegypt.com and https://www.facebook.com/AviationEgypt, has a good reputation and arranges overflight and landing permits “anywhere in the world”.
I recommend https://safeairspace.net/ to get an overview of guidance with respect to threats to air safety, currently mainly Sinai and Yemen. They used to have warning on the Jeddah FIR (Saudi Arabia), too, but that seems to have been suspended now.
Buckerfan wrote:
The Israel permission is really hard to obtain. (…) you need someone in Israel who will speak for you and they have to prove they have known you well for some time. I failed twice with two different people who I had met a few times, that was not enough for the security people (…) both prominent people (eg IDF Air Force colonel, large business owner etc).
The best contact to give is one related to the flight; e.g. if you go for a conference, then the conference organiser. In the case of an overflight or just “stop on the way to”, you have no one like that “obviously”. Failing that a “general contact” that knows you closely works for me.
What you write roughly matches my experience, except I have “Mediterranean definition close” family (aunts and cousins) there so in the end I get the authorisation after quite some palavering. But indeed the first time I tried with “prominent people” that were less close to me, but that didn’t satisfy the security people at all.
I’ve heard (on this forum IIRC) a report that sounded easier, along the lines of my business customer / provider spoke for me and it was OK". <shrug>
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