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Day trip Mallorca to the French Pyrenees

85 Posts

12-Oct-21 19:47

Great report about the “Courchevel of the Pyrenees”. Anybody here who has flown into both fields and can comment on the differences? While we know Courchevel is suitable for bigger aircraft like PC12 etc. do those land at LFIP also?

www.ing-golze.de

EDAZ

13-Oct-21 09:07

I flew just once to Courchevel LFLJ over a decade ago to meet an instructor for the site qualification.

The main differences are:

RUNWAY The runway used to be much longer at LFLJ with 530m, whereas LFIP used to be about 340m with an unpaved level 200m SWY at the bottom. That used to be a huge difference. LFIP was however subsequently paved in the level area at the bottom (some three years ago when the 007 name was added) and is now 470m plus a 75m CWY. Slopes is also higher at LFLJ (19% vs 15%) Width is 40m at LFLJ vs 20m at LFIP, which changes the visual impression completely. In both cases you need to use the Altimeter and VSI to supplement your references for glideslope.

AFIS and other services at LFLJ but not so at LFIP. LFIP is nonetheless walking distance to the main resort at Peyragudes

UNDERSHOOT- The undershoot at LFLJ is a wall that will kill you, but at LFIP you have a CWY with ground effect, that partially compensates for the shorter runway. In practice I end up using the runway as when it was shorter (landing uphill) as otherwise, if you fail to land on the initial 50m , you will find yourself flying into the uphill with a very high vertical speed (relative to the sloped runway) , so the urge to flare paralleling the runway is very high. Bear in mind the “level area” at the bottom is 13% upslope at LFLJ changing to 19% but on LFIP it is 4% upslope changing to 15% . At least if you undershoot now you have asphalt to land on.

From the current AIP (DO NOT USE FOR FUTURE REFERENCE)

LFLJ:

LFIP:

In sumary: the combination of profile, length and slope mean the runway is shorter at LFIP and you need to manage it accordingly aiming low on the CWY. LFLJ gives a bit more margin and the unforgiving undershoot encourages you to aim a bit higher onto the threshold.

I believe the largest aircraft to ever land at LFLJ was the DASH-7

whereas at LFIP it was L-39’s for the opening scene of “007-Tomorrow Never Dies”

Though I am unsure if the L-39’s were flown-in or trucked-in.

Failing that, to the best of my knowledge the largest aircraft at LFIP have been Cessna 210’s . A famous one neglected to extend the landing gear (seems to be easier at these airfields due to the changed approach sequencing)

TB20’s from the Ecole National have also been known to use LFIP.

This pic of LFIP from Jetphotos

And these pics from a video by @aart, I’ll try to post the video later.

Last Edited by Antonio at 13 Oct 09:35

Antonio

LESB, Spain

13-Oct-21 09:23

Also, beware LFIP is frequently notamed closed when required for ground vehicle parking space by the Peyragudes resort, as part of the joint use agreement. This happens often at weekends during winter season, whereas LFLJ is mostly open during winter season.

Antonio

LESB, Spain

13-Oct-21 09:26

Thanks for the refreshing summary !

Antonio wrote:

whereas at LFIP it was L-39’s for the opening scene of “007-Tomorrow Never Dies”

I had the impression they flew it there (it was based at Duxford/NorthWeald), the rest of the fleet was brought in containers

Last Edited by Ibra at 13 Oct 09:27

Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom

13-Oct-21 09:41

Ibra wrote:

they flew it there

If that was the case then it must have been quite a chalenge to land the L-39’s on a then-340m long runway at 5200ft elev! Have you found any references or pics for that?