To CPL or not?

You aren’t too old but if you can’t legally work in Europe you have a problem. You could get an FAA ATPL if you have the 1500 hours and work in the US. But without the right to work in Europe, no-one here will sponsor you to work in aviation.

Hi MO,

Congrats on scoring TK exams in German, ATPL ones will difficult tough irrespective of the language :)

I was in a similar position (less old tough) looking to transit from aircraft engineering to commercial airliner career but then decided that career switch is not worth the hassle, I think the age limit is not an issue I know someone who did make it at 42 years old…

I think entry hires in low cost European airliners is mainly toward pilots with European passports (from my UK perspective: UK+Irish one is the best combination), but don’t be put off by this as you said a couple more years and you get a work permit or citizenship and besides you still have time to train for CPL/ATPL, there is also a preference for pilots who speak European languages and you probably thick the box.

I don’t think there is much opportunity to do a “CPL/IR work” before full ATPL apart from instructing in flight schools…

Let me give you my two cents. I had never dreamed of becoming an airline pilot but I liked flying privately and wanted to be able to go also when weather was not that perfect, especially in the flat part of the country while the sun was shining in the mountains. So I was eager to get an IR and got some intel about the training. I was then told that if you want to do the CPL together with the IR and MEP it is just a few more hours flying and ATPL is just theory on top. I already had complex aircraft in my pocket so the few hours for the CPL were nothing and I am good at studying, so I went for all of it. There is another thing: if you go for IR only and decide to do the CPL later, you have to repeat a huge part of the theory and again going later for ATPL will include all PPL, CPL and IR theory. So it’s a good idea to make a decision in advance and take the whole theory you want in one go.

Back to my current situation: I have my CPL/MEP/IR with ATPL theory in Europe, I am an European citizen and currently 39 (had all tests completed at 36). I have about 400 hours experience and I have until now been unable to get a job. However, there are positions opened from time to time for which I can apply (I fulfill all requirements) and I was already invited to a couple of initial tests. The age is an issue in Switzerland which, unfortunately, does not have anti discrimination laws so companies set max age (note, however, that they have increase it, e.g. Edelweiss Air currently has a limit of 38 years while it was 35 or even 33 a couple of years ago). So your age is still OK to apply even in Switzerland. The EU has anti discrimination laws so companies like Easyjet, Ryanair and Austrian Airlines (currently hiring) have no age limitation and they do invite also older people. In the German speaking part speaking German is very important and a huge advantage, so keep on using and improving it.

Having myself waited 14 years for a passport, in my opinion it works fine if you don’t do stupid or illegal stuff, so don’t think too much about the politics. Follow the rules and go for your training and it will be fine. The work market for pilots seems to be opening but I wouldn’t put all my eggs in one basket and would go for the ATPL with a backup plan in my pocket. Anyway you will learn a lot and have a great experience, so if you can afford the time and money, I would recommend it.

MO wrote:

3) What kind of jobs are there in (or out of) Europe for low time straight-out-of-school CPL/IR pilots? I can’t really find any online that isn’t for a budget airline. I’d rather be a taxi driver than a bus driver, but I probably shouldn’t be picky.

To comment on this: I know people who got jobs flying small planes with their CPL but all of them got them through private connections. I cannot find any open positions publicly advertised and as Ibra said most people go for instruction or towing gliders.

MO wrote:

I am a bit old to be starting out. 32.

A friend of mine left IT job at that age, went for a right seat in small cargo turboprop, then right seat in bizzjet, then left seat in bizzjet and now he’s in right seat in Airbus 320. As far as I remember this career path included some investment in type rating.

The other job which you can do on a CPL/IR is ferrying planes. This can range from easy, to nontrivial if you are doing it between the USA and Europe, etc. I know a number of ferry pilots. To do the more complicated jobs and make a living, one needs to be well organised and not mess around and waste time. One pilot who has done many Atlantic ferries does maybe 2 long legs in one day. The issue of a working visa also doesn’t arise, for obvious practical reasons.

As regards getting an airline job, I can’t speak from personal experience but I know loads of people in that line and the general drift is that if they really like you at the interview and you really ace the simride, you will bypass most of the queue.

The professional market in the USA requires you to pay your dues either as a Flight Instructor, Para-drop pilot or Ag pilot. To fly right seat in Commercial Air Transport (Part 121) you need a full ATPL, i.e. 1500 hours TT plus the other requirements (P1, Cross country, Night, Jet orientation and Type rating). Some instructors transition through Corporate or Part 135 commuter after 1000 hours TT.

Airlines now offer sign on bonuses to flight instructors with the relevant experience, which is unheard of since 1903.