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Practice approaches - getting harder (and pre-booking)?

I guess it depends whether your objective is to “tick the box” of 6 approaches in 6 months, or to actually be competent at flying approaches in poor viz.

The biggest worry is usually regulatory currency

For actual currency, it’s tough to maintain, I love to operate under 1500m visbility & 500ft ceilings, even when I was actively looking for that kind of conditioms in UK, the average of hours you need to fly to ever get near instrument minima once is likely once in 50h-100h of flying per year…this year I only flew 3 times with actual ceilings near minima, two cases were with other pilots doing circular flights in weather on auto-pilot and one hand flown for the fun of it

Actually now when flying with family, it’s likely to be once in 100h of flying where I may plan against 1000ft ceiling, so I got myself 5000£ simulator at home, in case I need 200ft !

I don’t think it’s realistic to expect 6 approaches every 6 months in 200ft ceilings, unless one clocks +1000h of IFR flying per year

If we are talking about 2kft MDA in VMC, I am sure you can decend down to 200ft way bellow 2kft MDA with neddles displayed on screen? unless it’s designed as cloud-break or visual (LOC-A or RNP-A) your glidepath is always shown, safe and can be used for actual guidance and practice training (you are only supposed to be “visual” at 2kft, otherwise you keep flying)

Even with 200ft DA, I keep chasing those neddles to 10ft agl, one only decide to “continue” at 200ft? they need to keep flying that signal all the way to surface (in training & tests this gets skipped with people going missed above DA or wjen under examiners closing their eyes, pilots letting go controls or pulling the chute )

Last Edited by Ibra at 05 Sep 12:09
Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom

Then I really don’t see the fuss about high MDA?

I guess it depends whether your objective is to “tick the box” of 6 approaches in 6 months, or to actually be competent at flying approaches in poor viz.

> Most of the above mentioned locations are quite nice to visit, say for a meal or overnight.

I can’t argue with the statement, but it’s quite a big commitment of time compared to pottering over to an airport 20 mins flying time away.

Sadly, for me it’s all academic anyway, since I don’t have a plane any more.

LFMD, France

Then I really don’t see the fuss about high MDA?

Anyway, the last time going in good weather to Cannes on VFR FPL, I decided to ask ATC for IFR approach to Nice and low pass and I was surprised it worked like breeze (pax were happy with it, I assume FAA would be happy if I have put a hood rather than looking outside )

Last Edited by Ibra at 05 Sep 10:35
Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom

Ibra wrote:

I think in mountain areas it’s normal to have high MDA? does the FAA now reject these approaches for currency as they wanted people to fly ILS down to 200ft MDH?

No. The FAA minimum requirements for IR currency are in a sense not particularly restrictive. Only 6 approaches in 6 months rolling, a hold, and intercept (duh). They can be any kind of approaches. All NDB if one so wants. Nothing about approach minimum requirements.

LSZK, Switzerland

johnh wrote:

Calvi (closest) is 102nm from LFMD – an hour in a typical trainer, and all over water, not very comfy. Avignon is similar.

boscomantico wrote:

FAA IRs sure are difficult to maitain here.

I think that’s a question of perspective. Perhaps some countries and regions and more difficult than others, likely more for bureaucratic and/or financial reasons than lack of available IAPs. It is true though that Europe is not like the US where there are almost always several choices within 15-30 minutes flying. The density of airfields is simply not as great.

Not sure I follow what the problem would be with Avignon. Too far? If you’re looking for something within an hour of Cannes, that could be tough. But there are a few airports within 100-200nm of Cannes that should be fine….. Avignon LFMV, Nimes LFTW, Grenoble LFLS, Mendes LFNB, Beziers LFMU. Perhaps even Rodez LFCR, Lyon Bron LFLY or Perpignan LFMP but those are indeed 200nm. Montpellier LFMT and Lyon Saint Exupery LFLL are large airports so they might not be so accommodating. If you absolutely want an ILS, then the number of choices is limited because in France those are found mostly at major airports.

Most of the above mentioned locations are quite nice to visit, say for a meal or overnight. A trip to one every 2-3 months, changing up for variation, would keep an FAA IR current without difficulty. Each should be possible within a day from Cannes, easy with an overnight. France is generally easier than a lot of other places, and usually less expensive.

LSZK, Switzerland

I think in mountain areas it’s normal to have high MDA? does the FAA now reject these approaches for currency as they wanted people to fly ILS down to 200ft MDH?

FAA IR currency is self policed anyway, you can write what you feel works in logbook (you may read in EuroGA that something is wrong with this and that and all the details on what count and what does not but not everyone has that luxury)

Now, I feel bad about IFR people with 2kft MDA but it’s always sunny CAVOK in Cannes? I am more sorry for IFR people in Sion or Lugano who can’t land on ILS and get stuck when ceilings are under 5kft-8kft while VFR can go in & out with substantially way less than that, I am used to 150ft OCH in Southend but hey sometimes it comes with British weather, practically speaking, I think high MDA in those cliffs near French Rivera is not really an issue (“c’est l’IFR du beau temps”), I would get more concerned about those MDA for terrain accessibility in middle of Norway, Greenland, Switzerland or Colorado

Last Edited by Ibra at 05 Sep 10:01
Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom

Can’t you fly IFR to La Mole without landing

Never thought of that. Although with an MDA of 2400 it’s not much of an approach.

LFMD, France

@Johnh I think Hyeres is pretty open to you doing your IAPs there. It even has a civilian apron and taxis and rental cars.(although I’ve never used them)
An examiner friend says he uses it for tests. He doesn’t have to ask very nicely but I suppose the ATO might do that.
Look out the plates on the SIA website. I think you may well have to look under MIL.

France

Cuers doesn’t have anything, Le Castelet has an RNP with MDA of ~1000 AGL. Hyères has an ILS and an RNP, though I guess you have to ask very nicely to get to use it.

Can’t you fly IFR to La Mole without landing? with the site qualification you can land but I don’t recall that applies to instrument approach followed by going missed (they don’t accept mountain rating)

Last Edited by Ibra at 05 Sep 08:15
Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom

I do practice approaches at my airport and a nearby one that is 19 NM away. 6 approaches with a safety pilot takes me about an hour and a half. The airport nearby that I use has two RNAV (GPS) approaches (aka RNP) with LPV minimums of 200 DH for runway 6 and 250 DH for runway 24. They are back to back T designs with a hold IAF in the center. The missed approach hold is the entry for the IAP for the opposite runway, so I do 4 approaches, 2 to runway 6 and 2 to runway 24 alternating between runways. Then I head back and do an ILS to runway 2 at my home drome, do a missed approach and back for a localizer approach to the same runway, usually ending with a CTL. Both airports do not have a tower and I just have a safety pilot. The safety pilot only needs to be rated with at least a private pilot in a single engine land and have a current medical.. I don’t involve ATC when it is VFR, although I monitor their frequency. The safety pilot is the lookout for traffic and we coordinate each approach with any traffic in the pattern.

KUZA, United States
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