Peter wrote:
Here, car petrol is 5% ethanol and going to 10% soon, and “mogas” means filling up jerrycans at a petrol station. Where does MOGAS actually exist?
Peter, not every petrol station – some do not add ethanol.
Airborne_Again wrote:
OTOH, how common is MOGAS without any addition of ethanol these days?
There probably exist an app 
(I got one for Norway, used and created by some amcar enthusiasts). In Norway all Shell stations have zero ethanol/methanol, and most Esso stations as well. Circle K do have ethanol it seems, but who knows for sure. Then again, Circle K have good fast chargers
Esso is more honest. They have 95 and 95 E5, and only the 95 E5 may contain up to 5% ethanol (but probably don’t, as bioethanol is more expensive than gasoline). The spec is for 0 to <5 % BIO-ethanol. A cheaper fuel with 0% is well within the specs. It’s madness, somehow it is better to fill the tank with food than fuel Shell doesn’t think so though.
Hm. In Sweden petrol stations must mix in at least 6% ethanol in 95 octane petrol. The norm is 10% and if they mix in less than that they will have to pay a punitive fee. I don’t know if this is a Swedish or EU decision.
Same here.
I think it is an EU initiative. Of course the UK cannot afford to look “less green”. A bit daft since the car will do less MPG on E10…
But none of this is MOGAS. Who actually does MOGAS i.e. unleaded car petrol without ethanol, and with additional QA on stuff like water?
Airborne_Again wrote:
In Sweden petrol stations must mix in at least 6% ethanol in 95 octane petrol.
Peter wrote:
Of course the UK cannot afford to look “less green”
Considering more than 50% of new car sales now are electric here, that 5-10% bio-ethanol (better used as food for the hungry) doesn’t sound very “green” I can’t imagine there will ever be a law that say you MUST use at least 5% food in the fuel here. It’s not entirely correct though. As I understand most of the bio-ethanol comes from wood, but wood is very expensive these days.
Peter wrote:
But none of this is MOGAS. Who actually does MOGAS i.e. unleaded car petrol without ethanol, and with additional QA on stuff like water?
What kind of spec are you referring to? Is there a MOGAS spec? I though MOGAS was only a “fancy” way of saying gasoline. The only other alternative is UL91/96 (or what it is called).
LeSving wrote:
Is there a MOGAS spec?
Of course there are specifications for what you buy at petrol stations! European Standard EN 228:2013.
Airborne_Again wrote:
OTOH, how common is MOGAS without any addition of ethanol these days?
In Estonia, no ethanol in 98, and a lot of stations sell ethanol-free 95 also. The requirement to have a % of “green” stuff is covered by sale of biomethane by the same chains..
It’s been a very, very long time since I’ve been able to buy ethanol free fuel for ground vehicles in my area of the US, or for use in my plane (which has a 1980s era STC to allow it). However I think the use of auto fuel many years ago plus good leaning technique is what’s kept my never overhauled aircraft engine cylinder heads relatively clean.
In the UK, I understand petrol stations cannot add alcohol. It is added before delivery, at the depot.
Sea tankers don’t carry fuel with alcohol, so unless the small island depot can add it, the fuel there is delivered alcohol free.
I’m wondering if Super Unleaded is alcohol free?
The Jodel O200 ran mainly on Tesco 95 petrol. I’ve stuck to Avgas with the Bolkow O200 so far, fearing tank and pipe damage from non-alcohol and alcohol petrol components.
Airborne_Again wrote:
Of course there are specifications for what you buy at petrol stations! European Standard EN 228:2013.
That spec isn’t named, nor does it mention “MOGAS” as far as I know Also, the planes I have seen with STC for “MOGAS” don’t mention “MOGAS”. They specify gasoline with a minimum octane rating, and zero % methanol/ethanol.
I just wonder where the name “MOGAS” comes from. To my knowledge there exists no such spec, it’s just a nick name made up by pilots.
Alkylate gasoline, used for garden equipment, is probably the closest you get to 100LL with no lead and zero alcohol. It can be stored forever also. It is much “greener” than adding 5-10% alcohol into gasoline, since the alkylate is a clean condensate with no aromats etc (no carcinogenics). It’s typically bought at 1-5 L containers and costs almost twice as much as pump gasoline. It probably can be bought in larger quanta, and bulk, much cheaper though, I would think. This is also a “MOGAS”, and as far as I can see, it is a much purer and cleaner product than UL91/96 (or whatever they are called again) It also seems to be cheaper when bought in bulk. I would think it is produced in much larger volumes than AVGAS.
