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Is there, or should there be, a comeback on a flying school or an instructor?

This seems to be an example of an instructor getting busted, in seemingly unknown circumstances.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

LeSving,

That’s correct. Presently without an exemption a Part-FCL PPL(A) cannot be used as a LAPL(A) as might, for example, be desired in the case of reduced medical fitness. This will be put right in the amended Aircrew Regulation expected to be in effect by the end of the year or shortly thereafter.

Stickandrudderman,

Depends on the logging rules notified by the relevant competent authority. Under UK’s rules a successful check/assessment for rating/certificate revalidation or renewal is logged by the candidate as PICUS.

Maoraigh,

The UK PPL and NPPL are distinct licences. The UK PPL (lifetime validity) and, when it existed, the JAR-FCL PPL (5 year validity) were distinct also. A UK PPL or NPPL may be used to operate UK-reg EASA aeroplanes TMGs or helicopters as appropriate at the LAPL privilege level under the time-limited general exemption above.

London, United Kingdom

Back to my original post.
The salient points from the episode I have referred to are:
1. There must always be a conversation between student and instructor as to who is P1. A revalidation flight means that instructor is P1 whereas a renewal could mean that the student is P1UT or P1S.
2. In the event of a heavy landing ALWAYS get out and do a walk around to check for damage.
3. It is remarkably obvious but surprising how many people forget; even if you are a high-houred commercial pilot ALWAYS CONFIRM THREE GREENS BEFORE LANDING.

Forever learning
EGTB

Peter wrote:

In the FAA system, there is also the Class 3 which can be valid for a CPL, for an instructor, IIRC (i.e. working as a CFI).

And within the US there is also BasicMed. which many private pilots are now choosing instead of a 3rd Class Medical. Other than LSA (which substitutes a driver’s license for a medical certificate), BasicMed is the closest thing currently available to elimination of the FAA medical exam for private pilots, and like the 3rd Class Medical is also valid for flight instructors. In addition, FAA Flight Instructors do not need any medical if they are instructing a pilot already rated to fly the plane.

I know of an FI who got chucked out of a school due to doing a training flight with a student whose membership had lapsed. I believe it may have been posted here by the FI, years ago. It could be that they wanted the said FI out anyway for other reasons and this was a handy transgression (apparently also practiced occassionally by other FIs at the said “aeroclub” but those FIs had remained friendly with the Club President) but if one takes insurance conditions seriously, it is likely the flight was uninsured, for both the school and the instructor personally. If the insurer paid out post-crash, that would have been a bonus.

This was outside the UK and I am sure settling scores and all the other variations of human nature are pretty universal among all the sub-species of homo sapiens

This is true for all kinds of activities e.g. water-skiing; I used to be in a WS club where you paid £10 for a day membership. At the end of the day the manager pocketed most of the £10 notes if there was no accident I can write this because he died many years ago (due to eating too much, not skiing).

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Silvaire wrote:

I find this kind of stuff tiresome,

Yes and don’t we all The problem, certainly in the UK, is there is always a lurker who will gladly call the CAA, dub you in, and ruin your day. It is a particularly British thing, ‘Tall Poppy Syndrome’, where lots do not like you getting above your station. Inevitably, it is the innocent ones who get humped as the true rogues build riches.
All so British…….Anyway, whether we like it or not, no PIC without valid medical. (I think)

Fly safe. I want this thing to land l...
EGPF Glasgow

If you wish to use a PPL with a LAPL medical you have to surrender the PPL and be reissued with a LAPL. A PPL does not contain a LAPL in Section II of your licence.

Now retired from forums best wishes

Peter wrote:

That would make sense, that you can. But do the regs say that?

Who knows? The privilege section in the FCL about PPL does not mention LAPL as a privilege. But there is no way to get a LAPL from a PPL without converting the license to LAPL. Your PPL becomes invalid when converting, to my knowledge, but obviously the LAPL “is there” when converting since it’s only a matter of getting a document, it’s a downgrading sort of. One “high ranking” local here say, “Yes you can”, but it’s it’s all fudgy IMO, since none of this is mentioned in FCL or on the license itself.

I have sent a question to Norway CAA, hopefully an answer will come in not too long time.

The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway

In EASA land the privileges and eventual ratings are dependent on a current medical.

It may not be so simple if someone spends a lot of time unravelling the regs.

For example a CPL needs a Class 1 for some stuff, Class 2 for other stuff.

Does any EASA reg say a PPL or CPL is “invalid” without a medical? Sure, you cannot act as PIC without a medical.

In the FAA system, there is also the Class 3 which can be valid for a CPL, for an instructor, IIRC (i.e. working as a CFI).

Can I, or can I not use LAPL privileges on my PPL to fly past the validity for PPL, but within the validity for LAPL ? Without actually having a LAPL, but a PPL?

That would make sense, that you can. But do the regs say that?

Anyway, plenty of ways for somebody to screw up, being an instructor, if they work a bit “loosely”.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

My understanding is yes you can

EHLE / Lelystad, Netherlands, Netherlands
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