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How closely do you manage your maintenance?

This is a continuation from here.

That “relationship building” is really the hardest part, especially for a technically interested person like me (or even more so you?) because really wherever I was with my planes in the last 20 years I had experiences that were horrible.

Same with me, which is why I do what I do. I love flying and my negative experiences are almost wholly to do with maintenance companies (frozen elevator trims, leaking emergency gear release valves, defunct instruments) and in any activity which matters to “you”, you try to organise things so as the minimise the hassle.

Yet, people I know still take their planes to a known-bad company and they keep doing it, and then they complain about bad work and generally tear their hair out – when they could be on the N-reg and have a smoother ride.

But if you really just want to fly, you have no choice.

I think piston planes are like vintage cars. They are not anything like modern cars.

Turboprops – at the TBM level and above – and above are different, because the owners are invariably vastly more rich. To buy a TBM for $3.5M you need to have perhaps $10M kicking around. Not because you will need the other 6.5M but that’s just the way life is at that level. So it is completely understandable these pilots just drop the plane off for a €10k service (probably a 100 or 200hr one, not 50hrs).

But that doesn’t mean that they have to. If I got more money and I had the mission profile that fits, I would buy a used TBM700 and would run it on Part 91. I might be the only one in the world running a TBM on Real Part 91 but so be it

Jets I know nothing about. They might have a raft of lifed (I mean lifed as per the airworthiness limitations in the MM) parts which just cost $100k every so often. I don’t know.

Last Edited by Peter at 07 Feb 10:49
Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

No maintenance on my aircraft is carried out without my being present. The only exception is avionics work which tends to span over a longer time. There, I have one company I trust and supervise closely.

It all started for me because often the owner is faced with a lot of questions. Should this brake disk be kept for another year, is this a case of having to do a cylinder replacement, is such and such normal or needs investigation, etc. I then realized that while there are many good mechanics, their knowledge about specific aircraft types is very limited, first because they work on a huge variety of aircraft and secondly because they don’t spend much time trying to absorb knowledge. How many European mechanics are active in the usual type clubs? This is where the real knowledge is. Third reason is that very few mechanics are actually pilots, at least of the sort that rely flies those aircraft outside of their maintenance job.

It has not taken me long to learn more about my airframe than maybe 95% of the European mechanics. Of course there is still an awful lot they know better than I do but when it comes to airframe specific knowledge, I’m hard to beat in that scene. This puts me in the position to make well educated decisions about maintenance.

For the Cirrus, it might be a bit different because even in Europe there tend to be specialized shops. It’s like in the modern car world where mechanics only focus on one brand and know nothing about other brands. The majority of aircraft shops are like those old fashioned garages that know a bit about every model but don’t have any special knowledge in any particular. The latter are usually much cheaper than the former.

I don’t see it that way. I know that maintenance is a popular reason for going “N”-reg. On the other hand I’m pretty sure that the majority of german or UK registered airplanes who are under a CAMO are in better shape than many N-regs. Of course this is NOT the case for planes like yours or Achims. Let’s exclude you from what we are talking about here.

But it’s a fact that some of the airplanes I have chartered in the US and which had a valid and sometimes even new ARC – would go straight to the junkyard in Germany. And it’s also true that some people only go the N-way to save money, and in many cases they could not afford the planes they fly were they D-or G-registered.
Of course some german regulations are a bad joke. Take the AVIONICS ANNUAL. For a plane like my SR22 this would cost me a fortune. since my SR22 is G-regsitered i don’t have to do the whole thing – big advantage!

About maintenance companys: Yes, mistakes are beeing made all the time. I have now changed from Cirrus Germany to Beechcraft in EDMA. That looks like a much more professional organization, but it will be more expensive too, i am sure. I for myself have decided to take it more easy in the future. If I discover a mistake they made they have to do it again, but I am not going to get crazy about these things anymore. It’s just destroying my life quality to be obsessive about these things. And, final though, I would mistakes too, even if I studied aircraft maintenance day and night.

I tend to be with Alexis, here.
Monitoring the maintenance and physically doing it yourself are really two different things, even though, obviously, it helps with the first if you are capable of doing the second.

My aircraft is N-reg. I know rather exactly what, according to Part 91, is mandatory, what is recommended, and what is just “a good thing to do”.
Yet I hardly don’t do any maintenance myself and I don’t usually “follow” the work being done by the mechanics. But then I have an excellent shop (General Enterprises at EHGG, arguably the most prolific Cirrus shop in Europe). When it comes to things that either I would like to have done or is recommended by the manufacturer under Part 91, I will discuss each point with my AP/IA, and within the limits of safety, they will do anything they can to save me undue money and we will decide together what to do. In fact, very often it is me who says “wouldn’t it make sense to change xy this time, as it’s been in service for quite a while?” and they will often say “forget it, from our experience, that wouldn’t (yet) make any sense at all”. I do however tend to operate a “no squawks allowed principle” (which is probably slightly easier on a newish airframe than on a 35 year old one)

I really wonder if all shops in UK are so crap, or whether that’s just an exaggeration based on only a few, singular experiences.

I understand that being under EASA-reg., there isn’t quite so much flexibility. However, Alexis, I would consider getting rid of that CAMO stuff and the “controlled enviroment”. It’s just throwing some money at RGV for pushing papers and keeping track of flight hours and due dates of “lifed” items. Something that I really think an owner should do. It doesn’t really take up much time and also you are getting more and more “expert” now. Plus, if you have a shop like Beech doing the maintenance for you, I guess they will always have any open ear should you have any questions. The only argument for keeping RGV might be that your aircraft is G-reg. and you might want to have someone “involved” in the maintenance process who is expert on the particularities of G-registrations and the applicable regulations.

Last Edited by boscomantico at 07 Feb 12:11
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Any horror stories to share about Cirrus maintenance shops in Europe (keeping in mind that who works more also makes more mistakes in absolute numbers)?

There is a huge difference between an old airplane and a modern one like Cirrus. I would be much less worried giving a Cirrus to a specialized shop (but not to any other!) than doing the same with my old and more exotic complex bird. Simply because there are no specialized shops and an old aircraft for which not all parts are available or cost a fortune, a different approach needs to be taken.

I am with Achim and slightly more – no maintenance on my aircraft is carried out without my active participation in it with a screwdriver in hand, and I am eventually hoping to get my own Part 66 certification.
Regarding my trust in the maintenance facility, it’s a family business with the actual shop floor work being done by the son, who also owns and flies several aircraft, including a Stearman, and the CAMO part being done by the father who is a senior maintenance control engineer at BA. Can’t think of substantially better credentials.

LKBU (near Prague), Czech Republic

I am eventually hoping to get my own Part 66 certification

How do you plan to get that? I thought Part 66 wouldn’t be issued anymore in EASA land. That would be my dream of course, too but maybe I should carefully read the insolvency section in the newspaper and buy a Part 145

Bosco,

I have to check my options later this year. For now I’ll keep the CAMO until the next annual is over and then decide.

I think I pay very little money for RGV doing the paperwork, that’s why I kept them in the first place. And it’s good to have an interface to the CAA in England. I am NOT (!) starting communications about aircraft maintenance with any authority. And I also don’t know all legal aspects of a G-reg in Germny. Until now communication with RGV was very good, whenever i write to them i get an eMail back after an hour.

I’ll keep you updated :-)

Customer service and customer care at RGV are second to none, it is five stars (also their prices are five stars!). The only thing missing is they don’t seem to have an expert Cirrus pilot able or willing to extensively fly the plane to solve issues that can only be detected in flight (avionics glitches, engine high altitude tuning, noises, cabin heating or insulation problems, etc…).

At the opposite you have Cirrus Aviation in Bologna, the only Cirrus Approved maintenace shop in Italy until 2 months ago (now there is also Diamond Aero in Rome): the worst possible customer service and unresponsiveness but, on the paper, very qualified personnel and test-pilots with thousands flying hours experience on type. With them expect any initial quotation to develop into a much bigger bill once the works are finished (without any notice in the meanwhile!), which with RGV would never occur.

Last Edited by at 07 Feb 13:28
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