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General Aviation in Europe is Fantastic these days! (the counterpoint)

Pre-GPS, yes, but that is roughly pre-1995.

I’ve used GPS entirely since day 1 after getting the PPL, 2001. Without GPS, flying would be too much of an “adventure” for me, but OTOH nobody really cared (in Europe; might be different in Africa).

Of course the vast majority of people fly only locally and I am sure this was even more so pre-GPS. There is a lot of risk compensation in GA which conceals the risks that would have existed if you had to fly A-B.

OTOH, in those days, if you busted CAS, the outcome wasn’t as aggressive as it tends to be today, especially in some places. This has badly affected UK flying for many, within the last few years. The stories from the old days confirm that the whole environment was less “controlled”.

The makeup of the aircraft mix was different. The other day I spoke to an old maint co. owner. He said 30 years ago nearly all his business was twins (this was at EGKA) and today that part is zero. Even when I was doing my PPL, 2000-2001, the twin scene was on its way out. One thread.

Another big change is that if you go back far enough, customs/immigration was mostly unenforced; Brits used to fly to anywhere in France (say pre-2005). Nobody bothered with the GAR form until about 2008. Here is one from 1998 and here is one from 1986. But almost nobody who did those trips is still flying today.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Airborne_Again wrote:

If you compare IFR with the past century, the big, big, difference is RNAV. Previously you had to fly between VORs (or NDBs, even), not all of which had co-located DMEs so you were frequently in the dark about when you would pass the next waypoint. (Particularly as wind forecasts were both less accurate and less detailed.)

The same goes for VFR. GPS has made a huge change also there, which is very good because of today’s airspace structure. It’s a totally different thing to fly and much more accurate as well. Looking out for VRP’s is mostly a thing of the past, you can identify them all right but with an educated guess where they are. With a bit of preparation, today this is much easier. My usual routes simply go along ground identifyable waypoints and on LNAV / GPSS. Particularly today, where precision flying of VFR routes are more and more required and also supervised by residents using FR and other tools, this is a huge game changer.

Of course it also means that on bidirectional routes one has to be careful to avoid head on collisions…

I remember using the first GPS (after unsuccessful trying LORAN in Europe). I bought the very first aviation GPS which was the Pronav 100 (Later Garmin 100) for a ridiculous sum of money, but it was really cool to use on my flights to the South of France. It really took the guesswork out of it. We later got one (Garmin 100 AVD with database) for the Caravelle and used it very successfully particularly to the Canaries (where you were literally dead reckogning before). That was 1993 or so.

LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland

When I was working on my French PPL last year, every aeroclub seems to insist on GPS-free navigation. Pencil-and-stopwatch navigation is kind of interesting, and no doubt worked well in the 1930s. But now that you are required to fly to point QJ, defined by the intersection of a goat track and a drain pipe, it is hard work and very distracting. It’s useful to know how to do it, but to ban GPS from the cockpit – as two of the clubs I’ve interacted with do for their students – is just nuts and imo actively dangerous.

LFMD, France

All the clubs in this area, that I have experience of, allow and even encourage the use of SDVFR or equivalent. I will admit not all have panel mounted GPS and usually VRPs are the intersection of 2 major roads, a lake or a bay or a railway crossing. Usually quite easy to spot with the VAC chart loaded.

France

All the clubs in this area, that I have experience of, allow and even encourage the use of SDVFR or equivalent.

Interesting. At UACA (Cannes) the chief pilot nearly had a heart attack when I asked about use of an iPad. And at Dax it was just flat out forbidden.

Usually quite easy to spot with the VAC chart loaded.

I may have exaggerated a little, but not much.

LFBY NEA: Crossing of D 413 and power line 1,5 km W Lesgor
LFBY S: Crossroad between D 6 and « Route de la mine » 1.5 km North East St Lon Les Mines

D413 isn’t much more than a goat track. Luckily, once you know it, there is a very distinctive field close by.

D6 is easy enough to spot, the main road south out of Dax, presupposing of course that you keep a road atlas in the aircraft. But even at 1000 feet it’s really tricky to read the street names.

LFMD, France

@johnh I did my PPL well before the days of GPS. But most club training aircraft were equipped for vol de nuit and vfr on top. So compass/DI and watch were only a part of the PPL training along with VOR and NDB and in some cases DME. We were taught to use them to cross check watch and compass. Of course so many of these navaids have gone now which is why I am surprised that there are still club instructors insisting on no gps moving map.
Nice to be able to navigate by compass and watch only but IMO a bit silly to insist that all training should be without all the new technology available to the average student.
Especially as aids like SDVFR are available at zero cost and most students would have a smartphone or tablet to run it on. The bigger problem is where to mount it.

France

The bigger problem is where to mount it.

In my Cessna I had a fancy arrangement of MyGoFlight brackets mounted on the yoke:

http://n5296s.blogspot.com/2012/08/flying-ipad-happiness-at-last.html

But since then, and always in other aircraft, I just have an iPad mount with a velcro strap that holds it to my left knee. Works fine.

I am surprised that there are still club instructors insisting on no gps moving map.

At Dax they seemed convinced that this is what examiners were looking for. Though could also have something to do with the chief pilot, about whom the less said the better. No idea why Cannes takes this attitude.

LFMD, France

gallois wrote:

Especially as aids like SDVFR are available at zero cost…

What is SDVFR?

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

What is SDVFR?

The leading VFR nav app for the iPad in France. France only, and French only, but does a fantastic job of showing the confusing maze of controlled and restricted airspace in France in an easy-to-use way.

LFMD, France

The VAC plates can also be georefrenced on the moving map with all the VRPs shown and circuits shown. It is in fact a complete VFR flight bag similar to Skydemon and can in fact be integrated/coupled to skydemon. Round here the ppl examiners are quite happy for it to be used.
It also integrates with SOFIA(the vfr flight planning replacement for Olivia).

Last Edited by gallois at 21 May 20:16
France
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