Seems to be a very different issue across the countries.
In Germany it is no issue at all: For PPL, etc. the regional CAAs are responsible and the issuing of the license typically doesn’t take longer than about 10 days – so we are talking one weekend and for the vast majority of new pilots this is the “you have spent so much time on flying recently now you should take one weekend with family…” no fly weekend anyways.
For ratings where the national CAA is responsible the situation is mixed: IRs typically do not take that long, for Typeratings there have been times with quite substantial delays in the past but as far as I can hear situation has gotten much better.
And while a delayed TR can be significant economic challenge esp. for freelance pilots, it is hard to imagine that Peter is right and many pilots will say: “As LBA did not send me my 747-TR in time I will quit flying at all …” ;-)
No; not many will quit flying right away, but this must be a significant component in why ~90% give up in the first year or two. If they didn’t, the size of the GA community would grow rapidly, roughly doubling every 10-20 years. When most are starting off in flying, they don’t have the benefit of someone else’s experience and mentoring, not to mention previous (unlogged) flying experience. They are all excited, wanting to take their mates up… but they can’t.
They are probably simultaneously working from a load of old paper records and probably more than one failed attempt to computerise them, as well as whatever current system they’re in and perhaps a lot of excel files where they’ve tried a few times to get everything together in one common format.
That is probably true, and one former insider told me as much a few years ago. But with the money they are throwing at staff, they could get some smart people. It is after all “just PHP and a database”.
I’m quite happy with sigebel, using it a few time like gallois. It is a bit more complex when qualifications are done in another country (I’ve done aUPRT, FCL055 and MCC in other countries and to have to provide certificates of the ATO with). I have to say that they are efficient, which is surprising for a french administration.
The TR doesn’t seem to go with sigebel, for initial delivery at least, but didn’t wait for more than one week to receive the new paper. A friend of mine that did the same TR has been waiting for 3 months from the belgian CAA that seem utterly messy. It was actually a pity as he had a contract and a left seat waiting for him. He didn’t lose it because of the high demand for captains in bizjet world.
With regards to the UK licence issue arrangement being a contributor to people giving up early on, I think it might have an impact. Throughout your training, you have basically no involvement with CAA. An initial class 2 medical is usually no big deal, so the first time anyone really mentions “CAA” (besides the exams, which are easy enough) is when you pass your skills test and need to apply for the PPL.
Applying for the PPL is a complete pain and is the first taste that a new pilot will have of the regulators that govern aviation, and it leaves a really bad impression. The fact that everyone around you is cynical about [insert NAA here] really doesn’t help build enthusiasm either.
All that being said, I found that the period between passing the test and the PPL arriving in the post (about 8 weeks for me) was fairly useful. I couldn’t just go anywhere I wanted so I tried various other aircraft types, and types of flying, with different instructors. I found that once you’re past the ab initio phase, it’s quite a different experience and far, far more enjoyable than the PPL syllabus. I gained an introduction to farm strip flying which I found to be brilliant fun, and flying with an instructor allowed me to safely try new, more advanced and different flying.
However, for many pilots (especially younger people), the budget isn’t there to facilitate pissing a load of money away on rental and flying only with an instructor or solo. If you have to make each flight count, you’ll tend to want to fly with passengers more and you cannot do this until the PPL is issued, so it’s quite frustrating and disheartening. The situation encourages people to not fly during this period, and this seems to happen more often than not.
Amusingly, I’ve just applied for my IMC rating and I received an email from the CAA, in which they managed to misgender me as “Ms” 
and said that they cannot process my application unless I send a “certified copy of my pilots licence”. So, the CAA, who issued my PPL in September, require a copy of said PPL with the rating application. It’s really dumb.
IO390 wrote:
I send a “certified copy of my pilots licence”. So, the CAA, who issued my PPL in September, require a copy of said PPL with the rating application. It’s really dumb.
You have to wait until you are outside the country with covid “stay at home” for CAA fun to begin:
- You can’t sign it in the post or by judges/solicitors as they are not recognized by CAA
- You can’t ask foreign head of training (HoT) in EASA land as he is not recognized by CAA
The 1st LSD guy (license shared department), tells me to find a HoT in UK to get “certified copy of my pilots licence” by email, then the 2nd LSD guy, tells me they need one with paper & ink not email (and also that HoT have to physically see it to accept the signature, aka send it by post/mail), I wait 10 days and send it again, the 3rd LSD guy, just accept an email scan without much fuss !
Edited, I was just complaining about the quality of service I received from CAA, especially as I paid lot of money on it !
There was a sense that because it was after SOLI, I should expect a low service (but I did not get a price discount for that, it was 200£+300£ to get the CAA medical & license re-printed)
Graham wrote:
Airborne_Again wrote:necessary background checks before the first solo
What sort of checks are these?
Similar to the German ZÜP (Zuverlässigkeitsüberprufunf – suitability check.)
I know personally of one candidate where he did all his theory (condensed in a week’s residential course) and prepared to solo before requesting the ZÜP and it came back negative – due to too many speeding tickets. He still had his driving licence, just had been caught so many times and acrrued so many points (without being banned) that they decided he wasn’t to be allowed to fly a plane, because obviously he wouldn’t follow the rules of the road so why should he follow the rules of the air?
A second had his licence but because of financial concerns – his company eventually went under – his ZÜP and thus his licence was withdrawn….. be thankful you don’t have to be subjected to such checks every 5 years….
Peter wrote:
not many will quit flying right away, but this must be a significant component in why ~90% give up in the first year or two.
Don’t agree that this is a significant contributor. Not a single one I personally know who quit did it due to the bureaucracy. It’s annoying, but not a reason to quit.
Vast majority of people quit after 1-2 years due to the “What’s next?” syndrome. They have been at some not so distant places – perhaps did a trip in the alps or to the North Sea (from central Germany) and have had some flights with friends and colleagues. Now they realize that many of the people that “absolutely what to fly with him” are not so eager anymore when it is actually a possibility. So what next? Some start serious traveling. Vey few do acrobatics or some other fancy stuff – and many quit. Most of them not by conscious decision but by just flying less and less until at some point in time they realize they are no longer proficient enough that it is a good idea.
Role model for what we as an aviation community could for me are the scuba diving organizations: There you can basically do “one rating a year” – at least for many years. Not all of them are really meaningful bit it is something to work towards…
But that is a different discussion
Steve6443 wrote:
Similar to the German ZÜP (Zuverlässigkeitsüberprufunf – suitability check.)
Possibly – except that it is a one-off thing.
