Historically SVFR was also used to enter a Class A CTR (Class A extending all the way to SFC) with just a PPL – in the UK at least.
But not in weather less than VMC?
In the old days, SVFR required 10km visibility for PPL/NPPL holders (SVFR in less than 5000m visibility was only possible for IMCR/IR holders who could go down to 1800m/1500m, later to 1500m for all when SERA comes in)
This is “ANO licence restriction” for SVFR (not “ANO rules of the air”), as such an FAA PPL holder (not IR rated) could fly SVFR in Heathrow/Jersey Alpha CTR with 1500m, someone with NPPL or UKPPL still need 10000m visibility for SVFR
Well, confused or not. SERA 5010 clearly spells out what SVFR actually is. It’s a lowering of VMC to the minimum VMC (but not less), the same as minimum VMC in G. But it is done under authorization by ATC, and only in control zones with an active ATC.
If you like to call that IMC, fine. But it makes no sense logically. Clearly when flying IFR, the conditions are indeed IMC. When flying VFR, you cannot fly there in those conditions, unless ATC effectively lowers the conditions for you.
LeSving wrote:
If you like to call that IMC, fine. But it makes no sense logically. Clearly when flying IFR, the conditions are indeed IMC. When flying VFR, you cannot fly there in those conditions, unless ATC effectively lowers the conditions for you.
… unless you do NOT fly VFR, but special VFR aka SVFR?
Peter wrote:
Historically SVFR was also used to enter a Class A CTR (Class A extending all the way to SFC) with just a PPL – in the UK at least.
I’m fairly certain this was UK only and was a filed difference with ICAO. It certainly seemed very odd to me when I moved to the UK in the early 1990’s, and nobody in the UK I met at the time seemed to be familiar with the use of SVFR for anything other than entering Class A. I discovered lots of other filed differences (Quadrantal rule etc.) and since most of the pilots and instructors I interacted with only flew in the UK, they were understandably not aware that many of the rules they had learnt were UK specific.
… unless you do NOT fly VFR, but special VFR aka SVFR?
Yes, it is special, as the name says, but it IS still VFR in VFR conditions as per SERA. 
But to the original topic. Why would you, inside a CTR, cancel IFR and go special VFR? I mean SVFR conditions are usually pretty bad, and ATC normally only give clearance for departure and landing exclusively.
Why would you, inside a CTR, cancel IFR and go special VFR?
OP question (*) he was flying ILS to see runway before flying SVFR to leave CTR and go elsewhere…in some countries or airports he could do that under IFR with no need to cancel
Most ATC units don’t allow “freestyle IFR” in CTR, you have to be in the following:
- Published instrument departures (SID or Omni)
- Published instrument landing (RNP or ILS)
- Circling area in CTR or radar surface in TMA
- Visual Approach to land along IAP
When I ask to join St-Cyr circuit from Pontoise ILS (let’s call it 20nm circle to land), the ATSU got really puzzled and offered me SVFR…some ATSU do insist you make full stop landing under IFR, close IFR flight plan before giving you taxi for SVFR…others ATSU clears you to destination on own navigation
(*)this scenario is bread and butter to anyone who operate from VFR airfields and cloud break on nearby ILS in marginal weather…it gets interesting on international flights as you get into funky stuff on how to file FPLs, GARs/GENDECs, PPRs, there are no correct answers
I personally would be happy with any ATC clearance to leave CTR from ILS in that scenario, irrespective of ATIS weather or ATC separation: VFR, IFR, SVFR, cancel, circle, circuit, visual…you name it, once I see ground from comforting weather on ILS, I just want to go home using my GPS if weather on ILS is not very comforting, you land straight ahead…
Ibra wrote:
once I see ground from comforting weather on ILS, I just want to go home using my GPS
Ibra wrote:
St-Cyr circuit from Pontoise ILS (let’s call it 20nm circle to land)
Exactly…I just want to go home in wx BKN008 2000 …and in my case it is only a 3nm extended circle to land…but since home is just outside CTR, I would need a SVFR clearance after the ILS…how else?
Ibra wrote:
(*)this scenario is bread and butter to anyone who operate from VFR airfields and cloud break on nearby ILS in marginal weather…it gets interesting on international flights as you get into funky stuff on how to file FPLs, GARs/GENDECs, PPRs, there are no correct answers
Ok thanks, so it’s a “ting” It’s not clear to me then what the problem should be. Either the VMC is OK (according to SERA ) or it isn’t. It reminds of an article I read from a seasoned Widerøe pilot about this EIR when that was a “thing”. What they did in the old days was to break through the clouds over open water, then “snake” the aircraft through fjords and around islands to the airport below the ceiling. It was something they definitely wanted to prevent, and the reason they made this GLS (GPS ILS) in the 80?/90s (the world’s first GPS approach system).
