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TB20

Not a bed article about the TB20 and the Panthera in the last Aviation Consumer.

I don’t have access to AC but I have a PDF of the TB20 article, which is a re-hash of one they did about 5 years ago and which contains some major errors. But yes it is very positive. It even mentions the writeup on my website

IMHO it was a mistake of Socata to drop the TB20/21.

I wonder what they say about the Panthera? Did they really fly it? There is only one flying, AFAIK, and is in Europe. Also it has the “old” engine.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Yes. Not sure how much it touched on the single shaft dual mags. Engine failures don’t appear a bit problem in the accident stats for the TB20 but the D3000 gets a lot of talk. Also, what was the difference between the D2000/D3000?

I think the TB20 is one of the new airframe that is worth investing in renewing avionics etc. It was certified to a high higher standard than the grandfather certified aircraft and therefore makes a good middle ground between those and post-2000 certified (Diamond, Cirrus)

Last Edited by DMEarc at 21 Jul 21:10

Engine failures don’t appear a bit problem in the accident stats for the TB20 but the D3000 gets a lot of talk.

Yes, a very stupid design decision. I have virtually the same engine and setup (TR182). It’s a single point of failure that you really do not need to have. Also it makes it much harder to adjust the magneto timing because you have to remove it entirely and do the internal adjustment on a bench. You can never adjust it as precisely as the discrete magnetos. A completely flawed concept, built to save a few dollars.

what was the difference between the D2000/D3000?

The D3000 is bigger and stronger. For my aircraft, both exist (with a SB to replace the D2000 with the D3000) and while people prefer the D3000, there are no reports of the D2000 causing any operational issues.

It was certified to a high higher standard than the grandfather certified aircraft

The drawback is that this made it very heavy and the useful load rather limited. This negative trend was finally reversed with the Cirrus G5 (although not by reducing weight).

There are extremely few engine stoppages due to the D3000 mag failure. I’ve heard of maybe two, and none on a TB20/21. These were in the USA, where some pilots never maintain anything. One guy in the Socata owner’s group “found” his VP prop seized up after 25 years…

I think Socata went for the -C4D5D variant because it is about $1000 cheaper. The story about not having room for two Bendix mags is false because one guy in the USA installed one! He got a letter from his FSDO saying it is legal to install any engine which shares a type certificate with his engine – an obviously bogus advice as he could install a 300HP engine, etc. When this was pointed out to him, he went very quiet Obviously he cannot be prosecuted by the FAA (if he got it in writing) but nobody else can rely on this “advice”.

The timing is not a problem if you use a competent overhauler for the mag. I don’t think there is a single good one in Europe because all the European mags have differering mag drops. I use QAA in Tulsa, Oklahoma, and the mag drops have always been exactly the same. One bunch of well known EASA145 shysters in the UK even refused to supply the work pack. I reported them to the CAA over this pretty worrying piece of “work” (what exactly are you hiding?) but they were uninterested. I never flew with that mag, wasting the 800 quid and sending it to the USA. I keep a spare D3000 mag on the shelf – cost me $2.5k.

Last Edited by Peter at 22 Jul 08:37
Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

The timing is not a problem if you use a competent overhauler for the mag.

It is trivial to adjust the timing and that is done during overhaul. However, the timing changes because there is vibration, there is friction and there is wear on the plastic parts which will never be 100% even. Every year during annual you will notice a slightly different timing and with the dual mags it requires removing the mag, opening it and adjusting it which is tedious. You can never adjust them as precisely as the single mags.

I don’t think there is a single good one in Europe because all the European mags have differering mag drops.

I disagree. It’s not rocket science. I know several qualified people around here.

Yes, they flew it in Slovenia, still with the ‘old’ engine. They have pointed out that the aircraft does not come any near the promised airspeed, but, also say that even if it is a bit slower than the promised speed it still will be an improvement on the current stock of aircraft.

If they get anywhere near the promised speed, it will be absolutely amazing.

BTW we have had a few threads on the Panthera: here

It would be useful to make a brief summary of the AC flight test and post it on one of the above threads.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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