Cheap airplanes to buy, own and fly thread

RobertL18C wrote:

I believe it is still well looked after on the continent.

It is in Slovenia and doing well I understand. Still registered G-ATOU as far as I know, but maybe this will change now.

Well if you are in the market, G-CKXI would probably be a candidate. Same type as G-ATOU and a nice VFR tourer. Get a GTN installed and maybe a S-Tec 30 and you’d be talking IFR.

RobertL18C wrote

subtle difference between the Paris-Nice and the Sicile

I think it was parallel evolution from the early Jodels.

The D.120 Paris-Nice was a Delemontez D.11 plan manufactured by Wassmer with some speed and comfort improvements. Continental C90.

The DR1051 Sicile then Sicile-Record was a Delemontez-Robin design manufactured by Robin, the DR1050 Ambassadeur with aerodynamic modifications to win the Sicily air races. Continental C90, Continental O-200, Potez 105hp, Lycoming O-235.

I can get the Robin and Jodel books out for more info The DR100 series and DR250 did amazingly in the giro of Sicily, maybe 10 out of the top 12 several years running, and against much faster planes like Comanches and twins.

The D120 is a different design from the DR1050, which is a Robin design, before he became a manufacturer.
There’s little difference between DR1050 Ambasadeur and Sicile – I’ve shared both. They have no tailfin, just a rudder. The big change is the Ambasadeur/Sicile DR1050-M15, which have a stabilator, tailfin and rudder, and increased AUW. I’ve never flown them.
They are superb designs, if you can master the after-landing control, in no-wind, on hard runways. I’ve landed well above the book crosswind limit, on tarred runway. They’re easy on grass
Empty mass: our DR1050 Sicile no spats 408 kg. MAUW 750kg.
Empty mass:: my Bolkow 208C no spats 405.3kg MAUW 630kg.
Both have O200 engines, the DR1050 has 10L more fuel, and cruises 12 knots faster. The DR1050 is wood and fabric, the Bolkow is metal.
I wouldn’t be happy leaving either outside in Scotland

IIRC the Paris – Nice had airbrakes but I don’t think the Sicile did. I sold a Paris -Nice some 5 or 6 years ago for a friend. It was a lovely aircraft and I was very tempted to buy it myself, especially at €13000.

The original Ambasadeur/Sicile DR1050 had airbrakes. I think the later Ambasadeur/Sicile DR1050-M1 have flaps.
(1050 is O200, 1051 is Potez engine.)

I’d hazard a guess the one at €9k OY-RPR is a better buy than the ad might suggest, I’d be surprised if the engine is 3500hrs and from 1968. I have first-hand knowledge of an O-200 at 3800hrs, and an engine from 1967 that was never split but they are rare examples. I would ask the seller about that, maybe there is value there for someone.

The airframe looks good, nice prop, mags, battery and no corrosion on things like the flap finger where you have dissimilar metals touching. All the O-200 Rallye’s have fly very differently, some are dead and some are lively. We bought a 1000hr Koliber 150 (Polish Rallye copy) before Christmas, 150hp with 8.33 and mode S in a 1990 airframe for less than a Cessna 150. We may buy some more of them.

When I looked at Kolibers once, at least 10-12 years ago, I ran into an issue with them having very restricted useful load. When comparing the TCDS figures for the Koliber and earlier 150 HP Rallyes that I thought would be identical, the earlier French planes had a higher gross weight. Any comments on either the validity or details of this conclusion?

It’s a bit mind boggling that the Rallyes of all flavors have settled into such unbelievably low resale value, and I could see a carefully selected example meeting @Snoopy’s needs.

I agree with WilliamF here.

Having said that, if I was looking, all 3 have interesting potential and you can’t really go wrong with that kind of pricing, a positive outcome of the PPI being the main condition.

- OY-RPR, very right, the thing to check here is the engine. The plus of this plane is that it already has an 8.33 radio and has relatively few hours. It needs a transponder however.
-I-SUDX needs an upgraded transponder as well, however it has a KT76A which means a Trigg TT31 can be a plug and play replacement. It also needs a 8.33 radio. The engine is near TBO, which is not a problem for private ops but to be considered. It looks to me a bit more shagged than the other two. I like the panel better though as it has more space.
- E7-DDY is not on an EASA register which gives it a slight disadvantage as import and registration might prove more difficult. It needs a total avionics upgrade. But it looks nicely maintained and has both engine and prop potential.

Of the 3 I would probably look at OY-RPR first. If the engine is fine and has remaining hours, if the PPI is fine, throw in a transponder and enjoy.

One more here in Portugal. € 15.5k.
https://www.planecheck.com?ent=da&id=43837 planecheck_CS_DIS_43837_pdf

This one looks really well cared for and maintained, it also has 8.33 and a G5, enough hours and even in calendar TBO. Leather interior and also outside quite nice. Would also need Mode S (TT31 for the KT76A) but may well be worth the additional money. Optically and interior wise by far the best in this list. It’s been on the market for a while so price may well come down if you are really interested.